It would have left me in the same position concerning my question. You went from incorrect story plots to not enough of them to point towards anything.
You said there are no snakes on that island.
I said there is evidence for it being another island that has snakes that are venomous. You said that’s not likely for someone to mistake a stick for a snake. I said he was probably picking up sticks that just happened to have a venomous snake in it.
Then we cycled through it a few times.
The “from- to” doesnt even make sense. It describes nothing i did.
I certainly did not say there are no snakes on any island mentioned.
Leading off with two falsehoods. Tsk.
Earlier, you changed what the bible actually says.
Some bible stories are true,
Its nothing to me if Paul got bitten by a viper. But what
was written about it is at best a highly inaccurate account.
Ive observed many people go to such extremes, and go further
to defend a non credible story just because it is in the bible.
My understanding of science includes the idea of understanding that the easiest person to fool is one’s self; nobody can be objective
without a consistent effort.
We may be seeing the opposite, with concocting ways for
such as “sea snakes” from the Indian Ocean being washedup in Croatia, that snakes hide in brush or under boards making it feasible
to pick one up and carry it about without noticing it is not a stick.
Now there is a stick with a snake inside it, 
How was the unique “clinging” behaviour rationalized?
We did not even get to how remarkable it was that people correctly
identified a snake as it was thrashed about in the rain.
But never mind. I thought that this forum was about bible reading in the light of science and reason, and that is where I was wrong.
I don’t think there was any sea snakes there. Just throwing that out as another possibility versus Paul being a liar.
I’m not changing the story in the Bible either.
Acts 28:1-6
New American Standard Bible
Safe at Malta
28 When they had been brought safely through, then we found out that the island was called Malta. 2 The natives showed us extraordinary kindness, for they kindled a fire and took us all in because of the rain that had started and because of the cold. 3 But when Paul had gathered a bundle of sticks and laid them on the fire, a viper came out because of the heat and fastened itself on his hand. 4 When the [d]natives saw the creature hanging from his hand, they began saying to one another, “Undoubtedly this man is a murderer, and though he has been saved from the sea, justice has not allowed him to live.” 5 However, Paul shook the creature off into the fire and suffered no harm. 6 Now they were expecting that he was going to swell up or suddenly fall down dead. But after they had waited a long time and had seen nothing unusual happen to him, they changed their minds and began to say that he was a god.
In this story we see Paul ends up on a island because of a shipwreck.
The name of the island is Melité. Starting in the 1600s the knights begin to express that Melité is transcribed as Malta. The links though say that it’s more likely it was a different island and that island has vipers.
It says Paul picked up sticks. He picked up a bundle of sticks and as he got close to the fire to toss it in the snake but him.
It’s not far fetched.
Um, sea snakes. Yeah. You just made it up
Anything to avoid an objective look at the
flaws in the story.
" Snake in a stick" that’s another.
Ignore my other comments on the absurdity of the story.
Im satisfied that this is how you wish to proceed
in defending the story, no further examples are needed.
Well thank you for time. Now that we understand how each other moves forward hopefully we won’t have to waste each other’s time. So definitely feel free to ignore me. I won’t take offense. Should add I also want take offense if you do respond. I generally do a decent job at not letting initial meetings carry long term judgements about someone.
Obviously I made up , as in came up with, the idea of the sea snake as a possibility, as unlikely as it could be.
Making up snakes hiding in a bundle of sticks though is not an outlier event. It’s a common event. Snakes routinely hide in tree debris. For a fact when herpetologist look for most snake species they look in forest debris… a storm would have knocked down a lot of debris.
You’re saying I was avoiding to look at the flaws? That’s what generated my responses was by looking into the flaws lol. Then learning new info and stead of contention surrounding it. So……
Hmm. Thought you were done.
You know what making things up actually is?
Look under “bad faith”, and elsewhere.
Of course a snake might be among sticks.
Mistaking a snake for a stick and carrying it about without noticing the difference is the absurd part you (lol) keep avoiding.
And without getting bitten.
And the thing of a viper “clinging”. They dont do that.
And the thing of people- notoriously superstitious about snakes and inept at identifying species at the best of times- will
go VIPER! for first prize,
As the poor thung is being thrashed about in the rain.
Its fine if your religion precludes an objective view.
Just say so.
In the event, its all good. I can add "sea snake " to my list of wacky
apologetics along with the answer to, “where did extra water from Noah’s flood go?”
“A wind wafted it to Neptune where it shines to this day as a
warning beacon against incoming rogue angels.”
I’ll be honest I can’t tell if you’re just trying to troll or if you’re just not equipped to understand the statements being made.
It says “ But when Paul had gathered a bundle of sticks and laid them on the fire, a viper came out because of the heat and fastened itself on his hand. “
It says what I said.
Paul picked up a bundle of sticks. That means he picked up a entire bundle of sticks. That’s several sticks. Given it’s not lumber that means he picked up potentially a dozen sticks in pile that ranged in diameters and sizes. He picked up a pile of sticks. He then carried that pile of sticks towards the fire. As he drew near that fire , the heat caused the snake to come out of the bundle of sticks and bit his hand. “
That is common. That’s not crazy. Plenty of people have picked up a pile of sticks or lumber and found a snake in it. Snakes hide in bundles of sticks. Including vipers.
You’re caught up on a snake fastening. Most snakes won’t latch on very often. But they definitely do. Tons of videos of snakes latching on. There is no reason to not believe a snake may bite and not let immediately go.
So comparing a viper hiding in a bundle of sticks thst comes out and bites the person carrying it to the flood myth is pretty ridiculous.
However, you are right I am done. If by now it’s something you can’t grasp then that’s a rut your stuck in and can’t see outside of. So on this subject you’re right there is no particular reason for me to listen to your objections or spend my time reasoning to them. The majority of people on these forums are generally reasonable. I think anyone will be able to work through this without landing on your opinion.
Even if snakes don’t typically live on the island, the possibility that a snake could arrive on a ship is real.
Lots of creatures in the US have arrived from other locales on ships.
Perhaps God placed the scales on Paul’s eyes on the road where he encountered Jesus to make him vulnerable and receptive.
Of course a viper COULD have arrived there somehow.
A cobra could show up in a NYC parking lot.
That happened not long ago and a woman got bitten.
She said if i remember the article, that she mistook it for a stick.
The police found the story fishy and soon learned it was her
“pet” that she illegally kept. So the story about parking lot.*
My objection to the story has to do with the multiple highly improbable evemts one after another…
We might believe “dog ate homework” but then if the student next claims that a burglar stole it, next day that a meteor hit it, next day
that it was a swarm of termites…see what i mean?
*there was also a motive for the Paul / viper story.
ETA Fact check.
It was Baltimore, not NYC
My house is surrounded by juro spiders now. They are building big webs, more than 10 feet across.
Apparently they hitched a ride on a storage container on a ship from Asia.
So invasive species do travel on ships.
They are pretty and relatively harmless, but they are there.
Of course. Very well known.
Is this presented as an argument for a viper biting Paul on Malta?
It is just an example of a foreign species arriving somewhere new on a ship.
That could have happened with the snake that bit Paul.
Absolutely.
Your spiders of course multiplied, much like Norway rats
all over the world.
If there were jjust one spider in Georgia do you think you’ d see it?
Again, I am talking probabilities.
I agree, it could have happened.
How probable do you think it is that with an island wide population
of one, Paul managed to find it?
If I was at the shore near a shipwreck site and the spider was the size of a snake, I might see it.
Wasn’t this a shipwreck and they were on shore after the crash? If the viper had been on Paul’s ship stowed away in provisions, it is very likely it would have hidden among sticks after washing up.
Of course it COULD have been a viper in the island. Even came on the same boat is possible. Paul found it is possible.
Super unlikely, but sure. And the island could be
misidentified. Also possible
Dog could have eaten the homework too. We never believe it though,
because its so unlikely.
So, anyway, “the presence of a viper” is the first improbable.
Number two.
Gathering sticks. Heres a stick, there’s a stick.
And heres a snake.
You’ve seen snakes.
Possible to think its a stick at a glance.
Ive picked up snakes, none acted like sticks.
Most tried to bite.
Pick up a snake, add it to the bundle.
Never notice its a snake.
Do you find this plausible?
I often pick up multiple sticks at once while working in the woods. It would be very easy to gather a group of sticks at once that were hiding a snake.
Picking up sticks for a fire one at a time can be hard on the back .
Its my nature to be analytical and work things through.
Lets try to work this through together?
You didnt say if you find it likely that a non native snake
happened to be there for Paul to pick up.
Ive a feeling one could hang around that beach for an awful long
time waiting for a vioer to show up.
What do you think?
As for gathering sticks, are you envisioning a a lot of small sticks
that you stoop and rake together, or open your hand wide enoigh
to grab several, and not notice a snake?
Do you find it entirely reasonable that a person would fail
to notice?
Is that like a freak accident or everyday stuff?
It was dusk, maybe? “…it had begun to rain and was cold”, at any rate, and maybe they were stooped over and shivering, not out with their field notebooks recording scientific observations. 
True, that sounds conceivable for all that one
neednt be a scientist to note that the stick is wriggling.
Do you wish to defend the story or dispassionately
examine each detail and see if it seems plausible?
You are reasonable so far, not altering the account or
inventing things like sea snakes in the Mediterranean
“Let your conversation be always full of grace, seasoned with salt, so that you may know how to answer everyone.” -Colossians 4:6
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