Should the non-religious/atheistic position of Scientists tell us something?

[T_aquaticus]

@NickolaosPappas

In this report several scientists were asked whether or no they believed in God or at least a higher power.41% of them (almost close to the half)answered as beign atheists or at least agnostics.So is that high number of scientists who reject God concern us?Is that a motive maybe for us to question our faith and compare ourselves to them?

Speaking as an atheist scientist . . .

I would be deeply disappointed if someone gave up their faith because scientists tend to be less religious. I see absolutely no reason why the percentage of believing scientists should make you question anything about your religious beliefs (unless they directly contradict well established science, which is a different topic altogether).

Scientists do tend to be pretty sharp being that the profession requires a good education, life-long learning, and a propensity for analytical thinking. However, intelligence isn’t the same as wisdom. Scientists are really good at doing science, but they are as fallible as anyone else when it comes to the human experience. Scientists are really good at doing science, but not always that great at the human being thing.

However, the numbers you refer to do needs some sort of explanation. Science is applied skepticism, so it is a natural draw for skeptics which are made up of a disproportionate number of atheists. There has long been a tension between science and some theological outlooks, so it isn’t surprising if some potential scientists are pushed away from the sciences because of those beliefs. How many good and important scientists are we missing today because they happened to be raised in a church that strongly pushed YEC? For this reason, BioLogos is not only an asset for the Christian community but our community as a whole.

I would also suggest reading an essay by Dr. Francis Collins entitled “Faiith and the Human Genome”. Dr. Collins converted to Christianity when he was in college training to be a scientist, and he discusses how he is able to join his beliefs and science. I think it is right up your alley, and Dr. Collins also happens to be one of the founders of BioLogos.

[Klax (The only thing that matters is faith expressed in love.)]

@heddle

scientists (with larger egos)

How does one measure ego size? How does studying science enlarge ego? What foolish things shame which wise?

[marta]

@heddle

are more immune to familial and cultural pressures and are therefore simply more honest and comfortable in declaring their unbelief

But what if it’s the other way round? By that I mean, what if the scientific environment is hostile to religious beliefs, what if young scientists who are only just joining the profession are worried that being a theist may hold back their career? What if they keep hearing their peers sneering at Christians and putting them down? Experience tells me that people really want to fit in, and it takes minimal pressure.

Also @NickolaosPappas you are concerned that a lot of scientists aren’t religious. But every time someone mentions Dr Collins, or another brilliant scientist who is a Christian, do you know happens? Immediately an atheist(and sometimes even a fellow Christian) points out this is not a proof whatsoever. So if they are Christian, that means nothing, if they’re not, then we should be worried why they aren’t religious…

[NickolaosPappas (Nick)]

@marta

someone mentions Dr Collins, or another brilliant scientist who is a Christian, do you know happens? Immediately an atheist(and sometimes even a fellow Christian) points out this is not a proof whatsoever. So if they are Christian, that means nothing, if they’re not, then we should be worried why they aren’t religious…

I never say this.I am aware there are christian scientists and im glad they do.And it counts as proof

[marta]

@NickolaosPappas

And it counts as proof

If it is a proof to you, then I won’t argue.
To me it isn’t a proof of God’s existence*, but I’m still very glad there are at least some top scientists, some are even very devout. It is good to see representation of your own kind, in similar way ethnic minorities wants to be represented in media, for example.

*I think it is valid however, to argue that if very clever and educated people can be theists(even if they are in minority) then it shows that it’s not completely unreasonable to believe. Some of course would disagree.

[NickolaosPappas (Nick)]

@marta

To me it isn’t a proof of God’s existence*

Ohh i wasnt refering to that proof but

@marta

I think it is valid however, to argue that if very clever and educated people can be theists(even if they are in minority) then it shows that it’s not completely unreasonable to believe.

This.That is the proof .That it is not unreasonable to believe in God

[heddle (David Heddle)]

@marta

But what if it’s the other way round? By that I mean, what if the scientific environment is hostile to religious beliefs, what if young scientists who are only just joining the profession are worried that being a theist may hold back their career?

I can only speak anecdotally and for physics only. The environment is not hostile. I have never experienced anything negative because of my faith, which is known among my colleagues. Adding to my perspective, I was a professional scientist and an atheist before I was saved in my 30’s, and I never knew of or participated in any antagonism toward believers. As a professor, I can say in my own experience if you want to see antagonism towards and mocking of believers, you’ll find much more in the Humanities than in the physics department.

One thing I forgot as a contributor to the smaller percentage of believers among scientists is that potential scientists might be discouraged by the messages sent to them in Christian colleges and at a disadvantage because of (with a few notable exceptions) the woefully inadequate science curriculum in Christian colleges.

[NickolaosPappas (Nick)]

@heddle

experience if you want to see antagonism towards and mocking of believers, you’ll find much more in the Humanities than in the physics department.

Its sad though really.Beign mocked about it.Ive been there (beign mocked for beign a Christian)during my high school years and it wasnt beautifull let me tell you that

[marvin (Christian Sceptic)]

you are a bit out of date

Eminent scientists reject the supernatural

and considering the peer pressure amongst them this is not surprising, as the religiophobes amongst the scientist are quite outspoken in their attempt to discredit their opponents claiming them to be intellectually inferior. NDTysson regularly comments that the 93% atheists in the US academy of science are not the point of worry but the 7% remaining believers in a personal God are Religion Vs Science: Can The Two Coexist? | Neil deGrasse Tyson - YouTube
but then what do you expect from a scientist who neither understands the need to combine the breathing and eating tube in land animals, or confuses his reproductive organs with an entertainment complex Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design - YouTube.

considering that science is these days a career move and the negative correlation between religiosity and income https://www.reddit.com/r/dataisbeautiful/comments/2d4csj/is_religion_an_important_part_of_your_daily_life/
one should not be surprised. I think the problem was already addressed in the bible somewhere

[Klax (The only thing that matters is faith expressed in love.)]

@NickolaosPappas

@heddle

experience if you want to see antagonism towards and mocking of believers, you’ll find much more in the Humanities than in the physics department.

Its sad though really.Beign mocked about it.Ive been there (beign mocked for beign a Christian)during my high school years and it wasnt beautifull let me tell you that

Were you mocked for visiting widows and orphans in their affliction, serving the poor, being kind, generous, tolerant or something else?

[NickolaosPappas (Nick)]

Ohh so its alright to be mocked just about your belief even if you dont(cant in my instance) do these things?I was a teenWould you want me to go to the orphanage and meet with kids at that age or support emotionally a widow?I did what i could and they still mocked me.As they have done elsewhere in the world.So please stop about this topic.You clearly havent been there.Whats this comparisson?Live in your dream world Klax and let us deal with the hard things in life,Because ive never seen someone so out of touch from reality in this world than you.At least thats what i get about your writings

[Klax (The only thing that matters is faith expressed in love.)]

@NickolaosPappas

Ohh so its alright to be mocked just about your belief even if you dont(cant in my instance) do these things?I was a teenWould you want me to go to the orphanage and meet with kids at that age or support emotionally a widow?I did what i could and they still mocked me.As they have done elsewhere in the world.So please stup about this topic.You clearly havent been there.Whats this comparisson?Live in your dream world Klax and let us deal with the hard things in life,Because ive never seen someone so out of touch from reality in this world than you.At least thats what i get about your writings

So what were you mocked for again?

[NickolaosPappas (Nick)]

Beign a christian.You know people get killed for beign christians in some parts of the world.Get off your little cloud thinking"ohh h you just whine and whine while everything its great".Every group is facing some kind of descrimanation expect for Christians according to you huh?Because ive seen you elsewhere claiming that

[Klax (The only thing that matters is faith expressed in love.)]

@NickolaosPappas

Beign a christian.You know people get killed for beign christians in some parts of the world.Get off your little cloud thinking"ohh h you just whine and whine while everything its great".Every group is facing some kind of descrimanation expect for Christians according to you huh?Because ive seen you elsewhere claiming that

How were you Christian?

[NickolaosPappas (Nick)]

How was i christian? You tell me

[Klax (The only thing that matters is faith expressed in love.)]

Well Christianity can only be measured, detected by faith expressed in love, not faith expressed in mere beliefs. So like the vast majority of us, not a lot. And as over the millennia Christianity has been expressed with all manner of evil as well as incoherent beliefs, it’s not surprising it gets mocked.

[NickolaosPappas (Nick)]

What does have to do with my experience of high school?Picture a teen at that age getting mocked m=by his peers becasue “Jesus doesnt exist” “Religion is stupid ewtc etc”.Do you think its so easy to change some people minds teens even?

[Klax (The only thing that matters is faith expressed in love.)]

It’s impossible to change anyone else’s mind unless they ask, and even then. What has you being mocked for your mere beliefs got to do with Christianity? [Packs of young humans are particularly cruel.]

[NickolaosPappas (Nick)]

@Klax

What has you being mocked for your mere beliefs got to do with Christianity?

My braincells are dying each time i talk with you mate i swear .You just got in the conversatiuon to say what exaclty?How is your post

@Klax

Were you mocked for visiting widows and orphans in their affliction, serving the poor, being kind, generous, tolerant or something else?

relevant to these two

@heddle

I can only speak anecdotally and for physics only. The environment is not hostile. I have never experienced anything negative because of my faith, which is known among my colleagues. Adding to my perspective, I was a professional scientist and an atheist before I was saved in my 30’s, and I never knew of or participated in any antagonism toward believers. As a professor, I can say in my own experience if you want to see antagonism towards and mocking of believers, you’ll find much more in the Humanities than in the physics department.

One thing I forgot as a contributor to the smaller percentage of believers among scientists is that potential scientists might be discouraged by the messages sent to them in Christian colleges and at a disadvantage because of (with a few notable exceptions) the woefully inadequate science curriculum in Christian colleges.

@NickolaosPappas

Its sad though really.Beign mocked about it.Ive been there (beign mocked for beign a Christian)during my high school years and it wasnt beautifull let me tell you that

@heddle just shared some experience he had and i shared one too/And youve just come here for what intend?To "show "us how can we become christians?

[Klax (The only thing that matters is faith expressed in love.)]

What if you’d been Jewish or Muslim or Hindu and declared your beliefs the same way? Would you have been similarly mocked?