I live in a community for people with disabilities. It is a Christian organization but not everyone who lives there is a Christian. You are not required to attend church or take a Bible study class. We have several residents who are Jewish and staff takes them to the Synagogue. We also have someone of the Bahai faith and he gets taken to his religious services.
Yesterday in History class, the teacher starts going on about Creation and Evolution, saying there’s no evidence for Evolution and that Evolution disproves God, and that the Creation account in Genesis is factual.
And of course he confuses Micro and Macro Evolution as well as survival of the fittest. He actually thought that survival of the fittest had to do with physical strength.
Of course I spoke up and said there’s plenty of evidence for Evolution, and that you don’t need to see something happening to know it happened.
I explained what I believed, that God guided Evolution and he says,
“I’ve never heard of an Evolutionist who believes that.”
I said, " I am a Christian first and foremost and accept Evolution."
I got so worked up I began to cry. Then he goes on to read nonsense from Answers in Genesis and the Institute of Creation “Research.” Which said that the belief in Evolutionary Creation was “evil.”
I thought what he spoke about had zero to do with history ad was completely inappropriate.
I was passionate but remained respectful throughout.
It was just a complete dumpster fire of ignorance.
This is mainly a vent and I’d appreciate some support.
He was wrong to imply you don’t have a Christian belief. It is a reality that some people are just ignorant about this issue. You could always invite your teacher to visit the BioLogos website and get better information. But his mind is probably closed to it. It’s not your responsibility to change his mind or get him to accept your point of view as valid. You can know in your heart that you are in good company with scientists and historians who know a lot more than your teacher.
No need to become emotional.I had a man sometime i met into my local park who started talking me about stuff like"Ohh you Christians killed so many pagans and burned so many of our temples" and"Christianity is not a greek religion so is hostile to the nation" and generally rumbling about how bad Christians were.Now this wasnt a christian so i had an easier time ignoring him and walked away saying "yeah yeah whatever ".My point is dont get emotional or something.If he doesnt want to get into a debate oyu know then why.Just nod your head and ignore him.Cheers
Personally I don’t see any logical fallacy or biased beliefs in the development of evolution. It’s a accurate interpretation of the the data.
Also I believe the best approach for people like that is not science. Some people are too ignorant to realize they are wrong.
But there is a lot of resources to look at the contextual analysis of genesis 1-11 to support that it’s not meant to be taken as literal history or science. You’ll not actually find any concrete support for YEC from science, history, or even the
Bible.
I’d already had a bad week and this was the cherry on top of the cake. I took deep offense to him implying that I was not a Christian for simply looking at the evidence. I think it’s hard not to get emotional when someone challenges deeply held beliefs.
There’s no need to criticize someone’s expression of emotion over this topic. Many of us know firsthand how deep-seated these kinds of beliefs about origins can be, on both sides. Also, in many situations simply “ignoring” someone is not an option. When it is coming from an authority figure in your own community (and for some people, in your own family), it’s likely to affect you deeply, sometimes in ways that can be difficult to understand.
I’m sorry for your experience, Emily. Even if he didn’t come right out and call you evil, it can feel like an attack when one of your beliefs is referred to that way. But I’m glad he seems open to reading more… I hope he will at least be able to speak more respectfully about those he disagrees with, even if his core beliefs don’t change.
The evidence for evolution is overwhelming. Evolution doesn’t even come close to disproving God. Why does he choose to make only the creation part factual while rejecting the later parts which disagree with creationism, like when Cain talks about a world full people who will kill him if he wanders about?
The so called distinction between micro and macro evolution is a creationist fabrication, and “survival of the fittest” is such an early distortion of natural selection that it has become little more than a strawman. The most successful survival strategy on the planet is that of cooperation.
This is particularly relevant to your community, because it is an old fallacy that by protecting the weaker members of society, you oppose evolution. This is incorrect. Evolution is driven by variation not by natural selection, which is only a filter. By protecting the weaker members of the community you increase possible variation and thus stimulate evolution. This better matches what we see in the history of evolution.
Creationists tend to hear only what they want to hear – reminds me of what Jesus said in Matthew 13:13 “seeing they do not see, and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand.”
I am not an “evolutionist,” I am a scientist… and I am a scientist first and foremost though I have accepted Christianity. They have a lot in common and are highly compatible, for neither are about what you believe. Science is about following procedural ideals and Christianity is about a gospel of salvation by the grace of God. It is the Gnostics who teach a gospel of salvation by a special “knowledge” and works of the mind.
I am reminded of the church of Ephesus spoken of in Rev 2 and Paul’s long talk in his epistle to the Galatians, about the danger of being seduced away from the gospel which he taught them.
It is all the lying to insist on beliefs contrary to all the data God sends us from the Earth and sky which is evil. Our society has become so terribly divided by all these lies and misinformation being put forward as a pseudo-TRUTH. But it is the nature of lies that they lead to more and more lies. So while these underground pseudo information networks have thrived recently serving the willfulness of those who prefer to re-write all of reality according to what they want to be the case, it only takes a pinhole of honest research and investigation to bring it all crashing down. You just have to be wary of anybody taking advantage of the situation with another over-simplified picture of reality.
Sorry i was trying to give advice for the next time the op is in a situation like that.When did i ever criticized beign emotional?This is an unjustified attack i feel on my person.It wasnt my intention and i was actually trying to help.
I was stating that you can try not to be since these people are not really good when they tend to judge blindly.Sorry you took it that way i didnt intend it in that matter at all
I dont think shedding tears for someone who clearly judges you blindly without even considering hearing your argument its good.So yeah i tend to ignore these people and thats the advice im gonna give.For me its a good one.
It’s not about whether it’s “good” or not. Emotions are what they are. If something doesn’t tend to bring you to tears, that’s fine, but understand that it may not be the case for someone else.
That doesnt mean that i wont give the advice.i dont know what will work for the op i just gave me advice.She can take it or leave it. You can also read my 2 answer to the op that i posted thanks.
Klax
(The only thing that matters is faith expressed in love.)
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It doesn’t need to. Evolution is proven, God is unprovable. That is true. Furthermore God is unnecessary for evolution and all the rest of nature. That is true. Science and rationality beyond do not lack anything in that they cannot disprove unprovable God.
I believe in God, the ground of all being, incarnate as Jesus. That is true too.
I am trying to understand why your tears reminded me of this. I think it was the talk of theses passages about their first love and my feeling that we have to remain true to why we believed in the first place. Our belief is not an open invitation for someone else to manipulate it as they choose. On the forum, you will see me frequently bring my logic back to the same reasons for why I believe.
It is terribly disturbing to be in that situation. Over the years I have had similar statements made and have struggled with how to respond. In this case, I would probably say something like, since you seemed interested in learning more about what Christians who see no conflict with evolution believe, let me give you this book which addresses those issues". Giving a website is an alternative, but less likely to be looked at. There are several appropriate books, like Origins by Deb and Loren Haarsma. I also like The Bible and Ancient Science as it focuses on how scripture is interpreted and that is the primary point of contention.
Hi there Emily,
I think you were very brave to speak up in class! Maybe your classmates would like to have a look at BioLogos too! If your teacher learns about God-sourced evolution, maybe his heart will open a little more. Disagreeing with him could be the best thing that happened to him that day. Sorry it hurt you - I understand you were having a bad day. I’m imagining the wonderful discussions that could be possible in that classroom, of God’s genius, His wisdom, creativity, and on and on!
God bless you Emily,
Bernadette
Personally I cringe whenever a anyone says something like that. As if emotion is something to be accessed only with good reason. Otherwise, why go there? Oh I don’t know because it is part of our humanity I suppose. There is a lot of entitlement that comes with being male but if you absorb the cultural norms uncritically it can really screw you up.