Vasculitis is inflammation, and why isn’t it the immune system attacking infected cells?
Maybe because immune systems are different between patients and so is viral load?
Immune system can be said to be different in two ways.
One is that a person’s immune system may be declined and thus not able to fight the virus. This happens when a person is stressed, especially where there is a perception of some external danger as for instance afraid that they may lose their job.
The other way is that there is an over reaction of the immune system. There are many theories about this but the medical industry claims that they just don’t know why. But there is no good evidence that this is ever due to a virus or any other pathogen.
Yes, the viral load is going to make a difference but it still won’t cause cytokine storms, which we are talking massive inflammation. If it was only attacking cells that were infected there would not be a problem, even with a large viral load. Unless deliberately injected with a unrealistically large viral load, i.e., artificial, even the large viral load one can get through infection is not going to be causing cytokine storms. It will only mean that the immune system will take much longer to deal with the problem. And there are cases, though I don’t know if this applies to covid 19, that the person has what they call a persistent infection. This means that the virus or bacteria is continuing to multiply and there are outbreaks of symptoms some times and not others. But even here, though the immune system will cause some inflammation, there is not the sort of inflammatory problem that causes an inability to breathe.
We see this excessive inflammation/ cytokine storms in other diseases like in COPD but if there is the presence of a virus the biomedical scientists are supposing that the really bad damage may caused by an overreaction of the immune response to the infection and not due to the virus itself. This is a hypothesis only. There are no infections in COPD in most cases and where there are it is a result of weakened and damaged lungs. But even with an infection it doesn’t change the COPD.
They use immuno-suppressive drugs to combat it. And the same in COVID 19 they have used immuno-suppressive drugs. They don’t attack the virus and the immune system won’t be able to attack the virus. So why do people recover with the steroids? Obviously the virus is not the villain that they are painting it up to be. It is only a bystander and not the problem.
@ani99,
If you’re saying that some of the problem with Covid is from an over expression of the immune response, that’s true in the ARDs like response. The virus made the initial insult, though.
The initial insult? What evidence have you? It is only an assumption made by the biomedical scientists. There is no evidence that the virus has anything to do “physically” with the cytokines storms. This is due to the idea that the virus is dangerous and damaging etc., etc., that is being shouted from the roof tops by all the authorities. This is a pitfall because when a person believes it then the immune system goes beserk. The virus is merely a bystander and nothing else.
This is the damage done by atheism, who refuse to accept anything other than the physical. It is why all diseases are being researched and treated by the paradigm that disease is a malfunction of or damage in the machine. The body is not a machine but purpose-driven.
I’m sorry. But what do you mean by “5x/week” ? Do you mean leaving your house at least 5x/week?
Perhaps because it really is dangerous and damaging.
1 Like
Yes. I’m too much of a hermit for the vaccine to work. 
1 Like
Galen proved that the body is sick from natural causes, and started to free us from millennia of appeasing the gods and spirits and blaming ourselves and others for sins as the cause of illness. Some, such as Christian scientism (not scientist), threw back to that. I am sorry, but there is the world of proof that evil intent is not the cause of illness, cancer, etc. Stress and some other things can change healing, but these are physiologic changes. The germ theory is well proven.
I am glad you are well. I do not know the details of your findings…if they were biopsy proven, etc, and even if they had appropriate workup. Physicians make mistakes. That is not a reason to chuck science in (though sometimes when it affects us strongly it makes us want to mistrust everything). I am truly sorry you had that terrible experience.
I think we have to recall, however, that statistically and factually, modern medicine has healed and prevented illness through vaccines, hygiene, medicines, and therapy in millions of people. It is a wonderful field, and I hope you enjoy researching it; as well as continued good health.
Thanks. Best of blessing in your health and understanding and happiness.
5 Likes
If 94% who get sick don’t have any serious symptoms and can ride it out resting at home AND many are asymptomatic, not even knowing that they had contacted the virus until tested, then it stands to reason that the virus is just an ordinary run of the mill flu virus.
Another thing to consider is that a virus is not a living entity and there is even debate among virologists as to whether viruses are not just exosomes. In any case they have no energy source and are basically a little bit of DNA in a protein capsule. The virus cannot cause any immune system “over-reactions”, much less over-reactions on healthy cells.
Scientists admit that they don’t know the cause of the cytokine storms, i.e., the massive inflammation. All of the people who have died have died as a result of the massive inflammation and not the virus. Yet it is put down to covid 19. I find a lot wrong with that, especially when they are scaring the general public.
I never said that evil intent can cause disease. It cannot. All that evil intent can do is to adversely influence another person so as to react adversely. It is a person’s reaction over time that causes physiological problems. And the germ theory does not take into account the effects when a person is stressed and their immune system is declined. It simply says infection equals disease. That is not the case.
I am not against science. I am against the objective of modern medicine being about money. Yes, a lot get healed but a lot die by doctor and medicine. In the USA a cool three quarters of a million people die of iatrogenic causes EVERY YEAR and they are not all mistakes. Many people die of prescribed dosages and recommended treatments. You can close your eyes to this if you wish, it is your prerogative, but I feel that it should be pointed to for those who want to take charge over their health.
If 94% of airplane flights took off and landed without incident, could we then ignore the 6% that ended in the death of all aboard and claim that airplanes are safe?
Could you imagine if the vaccine caused death or hospitalization in 6% of people who took it? People like yourself would be going ballistic about how dangerous the vaccine is.
There is no such debate. SARS-COV2 contains viral RNA that has no DNA match to anything in the human genome. The source of that RNA has to be from outside the body. Denying the existence of RNA viruses is just insane.
First, they are a little bit of RNA. Second, they don’t need any energy within the viral particles in order to have that RNA genome copied and new viral particles created by the host. The host has all the needed ingredients for viral replication other than the viral genome. The viral envelope is just there to inject that viral genome into a new host cell.
You just explained how everyone dies from infections, be it viral or bacterial. You might as well say that no one dies from falling since it is actually the sudden stop that kills people.
6 Likes
Perfect analogy!
1 Like
Gravity kills but only if you believe in it.
1 Like
I don’t know how to answer multiple quotes yet so I will put all of it in one post.
Your example of 94% of planes successful is not representative. 94% represents those infected people who got sick, suffer only a little worse or no worse than the flu. We don’t know how many people have had the virus. The people, who got sick maybe only a small percentage of all those infected and are asymptomatic. 6% have very serious symptoms and many die of their sickness. This small percentage, together with the fact that doctors don’t know the cause of the cytokine storms indicate to me at least that the problem is not due to the virus. The virus in other words is not a deadly dangerous virus to put it in dramatic terms.
We don’t really know how many people get sick or die of vaccines because very little information is published and drug companies are notorious for cherry-picking results of clinical trials, not only for vaccines but right across the board. There are several doctors like Dr. Ben Goldacre in the UK, who have made a living exposing the truth about clinical trial results gone missing in action.
Now as far as viruses vs. exosomes, I don’t know a lot about it except that there is a debate going on between virologists. Here is a short video (10mins) on youtube about it: Exosome Theory VS Virus Theory | In Depth Explanation - YouTube
Yes, some are RNA but some are DNA particle. They have no energy source so they are not living entities. They rely on other cells to replicate.
No everyone doesn’t die of infections. In the case of covid 19 it appears no one dies of the infection. The cytokine storms are not due to the infection.
As of this moment, more than 700k people have died from this virus. If 700k people had died from plane crashes just this year would you be claiming airplanes are safe? If a vaccine killed 700k people in 6 months would you think it is a safe vaccine?
There is no way they could cover up 100’s of thousands of deaths every year. You are pushing a baseless conspiracy theory.
There are crackpots making wild claims that have no scientific validity. That is not a debate, nor is there a debate within the scientific community. RNA viruses are real, and they are not exosomes.
7 Likes
Not really. Good statistics are kept in the US and most developed countries, and the main problem is that injuries are probably over reported as some adverse events are just coincidence rather than causative. Certainly, adverse events occur, but they are rare. See link for further info:
2 Likes
This is not true. Most likely NONE have died of the virus. The 700K or however many died, died of damage due to cytokine storms / massive inflammation, most particularly in the lungs. This is NOT due to the virus. Sure there is one of many theories making a case for the virus causes the immune system to overreact and attack normal cells, but it is only an untested hypothesis. There is however evidence that the person’s reactions to ideas about having a dangerous harmful virus in their lungs is the basic cause of the cytokine storms.
In the early chemotherapy trials where they were testing drugs that killed rapidly dividing cells, about 50% of the patients in the CONTROL arm, who were given a sugar pill in those days, ended up with the side effects of the real drug. How so?
To understand this one needs to realize that if a patient moved to believe that they had the real drug, because they desperately needed to believe it, then they knew (were told) that the real drug killed rapidly dividing cells. This BELIEF caused their immune system to ignite an inflammatory response to clear away the damaged cells. However their cells were not damaged. So the immune response, which was nothing more than cytokine storms, damaged healthy cells so their hair fell out and they vomited damaged gut linings etc.
This evidence is pushed aside in preference for the idea that the immune system has malfunctioned. Thus it can be said that the virus was the cause. There is no evidence that the virus is the cause and there is open admission of "we don’t know what caused the cytokine storms, i.e., the massive inflammation.
Thanks for the link.
My problems is this. IF vaccines were safe and adverse events very rare, then why pass a law, the National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act of 1986 that gives drug companies immunity from prosecution? Any lawsuits from injuries or deaths tied to vaccinations are not allowed by law in the US. This does not inspire trust for a lot of people.