The veracity of the claims made in the powerful video at:
is plain for all to see.
God bless,
jon
I havent had a chance to watch more than just the start of the video there, however, I have a couple of thoughts on this notion:
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Firstly, i want to acknowledge that many of the people here on Biologos (if not all) are such beautiful souls with a genuine love of their neighbour and despite many differences here, i have learned some truly insightful and wonderful Christian ideas from them. I personally do not think that AIG, Creation Ministries, even my own SDA Church spend enough time ensuring that we do not fall into the trap of making inferences and statements that appear to state that unless one adhears exactly to Biblical themes, one is going to hell. (I am also guilty of that btw)
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I think Christ has provided a very simple answer to the dilemma of Darwinian Evolution and Creationism, and that is demonstrated to me on these forums in point 1 above. In the story of the Good Samaritan, Christ demonstrated that what really matters is that we love our neighbour and do good to those who persecute us. The fruits of the spirit are
So whilst in the New Testament we are shown that salvation is not achievable by works, it is very clear that God expects that we make an effort to be more like Christ because of our faith and love for him.
- This forum has also reinforced the idea to me that God has witnesses in many placesâŚwe should not be concerned that those places might not align with our own beliefs. God is in control, he knows what he is doing. I think that one of the downsides to the conservatives associated with AIG is that they go too far in earbashing liberals and, despite the seemingly good intentions of this video, i do not agree with that habit âŚbut i am guilty of it myself.
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I did listen to the first 5 minutes of the video, and by then the speaker had already fallen into the false trope of implying that since Jesus or the apostles didnât have any evolutionary perspective that therefore any Christians today who allow for that must therefore be following these âfalse prophetsâ. Of course Jesus didnât seem to have any perspective about computers either, so I guess every Christian on the internet must be apostate by this reasoning. But there is plenty of teaching in scriptures about truth and integrity - so Iâm happy to stick with organizations that still value that!
The upshot is that @Burrawang âs video title raises a good concern - about false prophets. It just then goes on to misidentify them, and gives the real wolves a pass. How can any of us know who the real wolves are? By their fruit. Watch what they promote - the people they admire and put into power. Do they follow (or even know?) Jesusâ teachings in the sermon on the mount, or do they have theological excuses about why those donât apply? Iâm happy there are still a remnant (here in the U.S.) of organizations like Biologos that still believe in objective truth, reality, and scriptures. The video already spoke for itself within its first minutes in that I would only want to be discipled by him if I wanted to be misled about the world and events and kept in the dark about important scriptural teachings.
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im not following how this has anything to do with the Biologos idea that we can ignore fundamental Bible statements about creation and the flood?
What you are 100% ignoring here is that Christ in the New Testament, along with the Disciple/Apostle Peter make statements about Noahs Flood that align completely with the narrative in Genesis 6! (there is simply no denying these statements).
Also, Christ died physically on the cross for sinâŚif the creation account and fall of mankind were symbolic, then a man dying physically on the cross is completely unnecessaryâŚits even absurd. That is a fundamental theology that we find all through the Old Testament Sanctuary Service model and its played out in reality in the Gospels of the New Testament. This has nothing to do with two covenants!
That modern Christian two covenant theology regarding the commandments being done away with at the cross is just plain wrong and is proven wrong by the writings of the apostle John in AD 90âs in Revelation 14:12 (60 years AFTER Christs death)
The Bible clearly and very specifically prophesies that the wages of sin require a physcial outcomeâŚeternal physical death!
oh man, that is so fundamentally wrong mate. Hereâs whyâŚ
What you are missing is that false prophets are those who present ANTI-BIBLICAL teachings!!!
A person claiming your science is wrong because it does not align with the bible is not teaching theological heresy, they are teaching mainstream scientific heresy. These are two very different things.
The problem there is, whether you agree or not, the Bible makes the very specific claim that teachings of men are open to corruption.
The Bible also makes it very clear that Gods word is not corruptible or corrupted! The prophet Samuel highlights this very directly in his statement to King Saul âit is better to obey than to sacrificeâ King Saul decided to put his own interpretation on Biblical doctrine, he was impatient , self centered, entitled, and paid the penalty for that poor choice. He knew that what he was doing was against well known teachings and the directions of God and yet he did it anyway.
I think Iâll stick with Jesus on this one - as recorded by Matthew (in chapter 7).
BTW - thanks for sticking up for us - at least a little bit! - here at Biologos, Adam! Even though your disagreement persists, I still appreciate that from you!
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Hi Adam,
yes, what you have stated is absolutely correct, and please understand that I know that I am as guilty as anyone of being a worthless sinner.
When I knowingly stood in the presence of our gracious loving God for the very first time, I saw myself as I really am, and I was NOT impressed with what I saw.
Please understand that I am not attempting in any way to take any high moral ground here, but I am concerned that the veracity of the Holy Bible is being undermined by the 'wolves in sheepâs clothingâ who are among us and who distort and twist what is ever so clearly stated in the Holy Scriptures.
The Holy Bible is Godâs Holy Word to mankind.
The Holy Scriptures, attested by Jesus Himself as Truth, are not in error, the authors of the Holy Scriptures were inspired by the Holy Spirit, that is, He made absolutely certain, precisely what He wanted to communicate to us all.
God spoke the creation into existence, the galaxies, the Earth, ALL life!
It is such a little thing for One so Righteous, Just, Loving, Incomprehensibly Powerful and ALL Knowing to ensure the Holy Bible be exactly written as He wished.
Our Lord God knows the End before the Beginning.
The deception by the wolves in sheepâs clothing are doing exactly the same thing as what Satan did when he said to Eve in the garden of Eden, âDid God really sayâŚ?â
1 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden? 2 And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden: 3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die. 4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: 5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. Genesis 3:1 KJV
And after they both rebelled against Godâs explicit command, and ate the fruit, they were forbidden to touch, death entered the creation for the first time from that point forward, Adam and Eve 's physical bodies commenced the downhill process that eventually ended in their deaths!
I sincerely encourage you to watch the whole video through, as it relies solely upon Scripture, using Scripture to affirm the Truth, expose the blatant false teaching that has regrettably been made by the people mentioned that have written those beliefs on the Biologos website.
I am not affiliated with anyone, except the Lord Jesus, not CMI or AiG or any other organisation, but I recognise the Truth when I see it, and deception when I see it.
The deceitful passages quoted and highlighted in the video, are indisputably refuted by Holy Scripture as being just that, opposite to what the Holy Bible plainly teaches.
I wish I didnât have to place any post on this website, but have been compelled to do so, precisely because I do not wish that any be deceived.
Iâm reminded of these warnings to us all:
1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction. 2 And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of. 2 Peter 2:1 KJV
Jesus said:
15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheepâs clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. Matthew 7:15 KJV
God Bless,
jon
Dear Mervin,
if you had watched and listened to the whole video, (a little under 25 minutes long) it should become clear to you that there are deceptions being promulgated by some on this website that contradict what the Biblical writers wrote for our edification.
17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. 18 For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple. 19 For your obedience is come abroad unto all men. I am glad therefore on your behalf: but yet I would have you wise unto that which is good, and simple concerning evil. 20 And the God of peace shall bruise Satan under your feet shortly. The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you. Amen.
Romans 16:17-20 KJV
9 And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not. 10 As we have therefore opportunity, let us do good unto all men, especially unto them who are of the household of faith. Galatians 6:9
Jesus Himself taught that the Holy Scriptures are Faithful and True.
Any teaching that is contrary to what Jesus and the Apostles and the writers (under Holy Spirit inspiration) of the books of the Holy Bible taught, is false teaching, and needs to be called out for what it is.
God Bless,
jon
We contradict the human, fallible interpretation of the Bible by some.
From the YouTube transcription of the video at 23:42, which tells you all you need to know about this video.
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Im a bit ecclectic Mervin, so where we align, i support and defend.
Thank you Bill,
for your sincere reply, I wholly agree with the videoâs conclusion that you have provided above, (highlighted in bold text.)
The Holy Bible is the inerrant Word of God. I hope that we can at least agree on that.
Jesus Who is the Great I AM, the Creator, the Son Himself incarnate on Earth and in Heaven is Omnipotent, Omniscient, and Loving towards everyone of us.
He Loves you and everyone at Biologos. He died on that Roman cross about two thousand years ago, for every one of us, so that righteous and just penalty of death imputed to us because of sin committed in transgression of the Law, is fully and irrevocably paid for by Him Who was and is blameless.
We know that Jesus taught He made mankind in the beginning.
3 The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause? 4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, 5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? 6 Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. Matthew 19:-6 KJV
and similarly we are clearly informed by Mark also that Jesus said: âfrom the beginning of the creation God made them male and female.â
5 And Jesus answered and said unto them, For the hardness of your heart he wrote you this precept. 6 But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female. 7 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife; 8 And they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh. 9 What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. Mark 10:5-9 KJV
and arenât we informed in the Holy Bible very clearly and succinctly that God created mankind on the sixth day in creation week?
*26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth. 27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. 28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth. ***Genesis 1:26-28 KJV
Every word that Jesus spoke, is the same as the Father speaking, for Jesus and the Father are ONE. Thus, it is beyond any disagreement whatsoever that Jesus was NEVER in error. NOT ONCE did Jesus utter anything but absolute TRUTH. To claim anything else invokes both deception and special pleading.
44 Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on me, believeth not on me, but on him that sent me. 45 And he that seeth me seeth him that sent me. 46 I am come a light into the world, that whosoever believeth on me should not abide in darkness. 47 And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world. 48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. 49 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. 50 And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak. John 12:44-50 KJV
Anyone or anything, or any teaching, that claims in any way that Jesus was in error in anything He said or did,
(just because of His incomprehensible LOVE for us all, that He the Eternal One and Only Almighty, Living God, chose to humble Himself and become a human Man to provide a way of saving us all as our kinsman redeemer to rescue us from the dire predicament weâre all in, guilty of sin and its wages of death ),
is a false teaching.
Let a spade be called a spade and a lie be exposed as a lie.
With all gentleness and respect please understand that to say nothing is wrong, is evil and condemns those under the illusion of the false teaching to remain deceived.
Offending anyone is not the intention, but if you are aware of any other way to be honest about the presence of false teaching in a large organisation such as Biologos, please tell me what it is.
Please understand, I do not take what I have said lightly, this is a very serious matter, but it is necessary to shine the light on this deception that has a foothold in the hearts and minds of good people.
God Bless,
jon
Yeah i think its a bit much to play the âevil Biologosâ cardâŚi wouldnt agree with that even as an SDA.
God has his witnesses in a lot of places and i have found plenty of evidences of God here on these forums.
Probably i would draw the line at venturing into an illegal drug lab to find one (a Godly witness) though 
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Thanks for the hightlights, @Bill_II. They should have been part of @Burrawangâs OP.
Well, @Burrawang, I assume you will be leaving soon as you affirm :
You indicate that knowledge - particularly scientific knowledge - and critical thinking are really dangerous, to the point of heresy. To the point of hopelessness.
And then your gospel runs out of steam. It doesnât reach the people who know the âwrongâ things and tell the truth about them. Unless they unknow or deny what they do know.
I donât think Jesus made amnesia a requirement for salvation. How about your gospel? Got hope AND honesty?
From your posts here, you will surely already have left, logged out, 86ed your password, deleted your BL cookies and browser history and blocked the website. This is a dangerous place, after all.
Since you wonât be around anymore, I leave you my best regards. Fare well,
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I would say anyone claiming g to be a prophet today with be a false one.
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Thanks Kendel,
for your thoughts and opinions.
I sincerely apologise, but it is transparently clear that you have made a demonstrably false claim here that I, âindicate that knowledge - particularly scientific knowledge - and critical thinking are really dangerous, to the point of heresy. To the point of hopelessness.â
What I have stated is that âfalse teachingâ is just that, because it opposes the Truth given to us by God in the Holy Bible.
The Holy Bible plainly tells us that Adam and Eve were real people in a real garden with a real tree of the knowledge of good and evil and a real serpent that was clearly possessed by Satan. The Holy Bible also clearly informs us that about four and a half thousand years ago, evil had increased upon the face of the Earth to such an extent that God passed judgement upon the Earth and destroyed all life except for those people and animals within the enormous ark that He commanded Noah to build.
The geology of this planet is replete with sedimentary rock strata consistent with what we would expect to find from a catastrophic global flood as the Holy Bible faithfully tells us.
*12 Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets. 13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: {strait: or, narrow} 14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it. *
15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheepâs clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. 16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? 17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. 19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. 20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. Matthew 7:12-20 KJV
Also, contrary to your claim about me, I see absolutely no problem between science and the Holy Bible, indeed I understand that modern science only came about through devout Christian men who believed in the One and only Holy Living God of order, that we are told about in the Holy Bible, Who had fixed His Laws of nature as constants that permit us to exist here, in this peculiarly quiet part of our galaxy in the space between the spiral arms, on this extraordinarily very wet planet, protected from solar wind radiation by the Earthâs magnetic field, and protected from the high energy radiation of our galaxy by the Heliosphere, with all the universal constants fine tuned precisely for our benefit.
Yes, the above transcript may not sit well with many on this website, but that doesnât make it incorrect. Our Gracious Loving Lord God, is perfectly Holy, perfectly Just and perfectly Righteous. His perfect love for us all is incomprehensible in its enormity, but we should never take Him for granted, or deny what He has told us in the Holy Scriptures.
What the world needs now is a body of believers who are united in prayer and action to uphold the absolute authority of the Holy Bible. I mean honest people who are not ashamed of the Gospel of our Lord and Saviour and who do not bend, buckle and compromise for the worldview of âdeep timeâ and âevolution,â disguised as science and taught in most educational institutions.
Jesus said:
18 If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you.
19 If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you.
20 Remember the word that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also.
21 But all these things will they do unto you for my nameâs sake, because they know not him that sent me.
22 If I had not come and spoken unto them, they had not had sin: but now they have no cloak for their sin.
23 He that hateth me hateth my Father also.
24 If I had not done among them the works which none other man did, they had not had sin: but now have they both seen and hated both me and my Father. John 15:18-24 KJV
Jesus performed many miracles that are extraordinary events that indicate the complete deity of Jesus Himself. Jesus was not in error in anything He said or did as recorded in the Holy Scriptures.
ANYONE or ANYTHING that sets itself up to claim that Jesus was in error whilst He was on Earth physically with the Apostles, as reported in the Gospels, IS one of the many âwolves in sheepâs clothingâ that Jesus warned us to be wary of.
I am nothing, but a lowly sinner who has been saved by the gracious Love of my Lord and Saviour Jesus, the Risen Son of the Father, to whom ALL authority has been given.
God Bless,
jon
The Bible does not tell any of us that all of that is real. Thatâs just your interpretation of it. Itâs a very weak one too.
So you believe we live on a flat earth with a dome and the sun revolves around us?
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No. My statement is true. You did not address the problem I stated.
Instead you made this silly, false claim:
On the contrary, the geology of the planet is replete with sedementary rock that records an entirely different history of the planet than one described in flood accounts. I have a sample on my table in front of me.
You have yet to offer gospel assurance the helps those of us who know that. Calling left right and up down, then saying one must believe those to be saved is not the Gospel.
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Thank you for your thoughts.
Iâm sorry, but your words here in the first paragraph are plainly incorrect, the Holy Bible was written by men who were inspired by the Holy Spirit, Who knows the end before the beginning.
The Lord God knew that false prophets would arise, such as is occurring right now all over the Earth, and thus He went to great lengths to make certain that ALL people, then and now would understand the plain meaning of the eyewitness account of the creation by God Himself, and the account of the Global Flood that was absolute in its catastrophic devastation, that changed the face of the whole Earth from a single landmass surrounded by sea to the continental configuration we see today. And in the process laying down the vast sheets of sedimentary rock found all over the Earth.
With regard to the second paragraph, I will not engage in such nonsense as a flat Earth lest you be wise in your own eyes.
God Bless,
jon
You see, that is the problem. Flood geologists claim to be faithful to scripture, but then peddle false witness. That is morally compromised, so why should anyone trust such folk for spiritual direction?
That the earth is far older than 6,000 years has been known for a couple of centuries, but the integrated understanding of today extends massive detail and study which has taken place since. Pick any accessible coordinate of earthâs surface, and there will be geological descriptions which account for the age, and more importantly, the history of the underlying formations - sedimentary, igneous, and conglomerate.
So to join the AiG fold, one is expected to renounce reality. The simpler the thing that has to be explained away, the more gibberish the explanation - the distant starlight problem which is not a real physical problem to begin with, or cratering on earth, the moon, mercury, and even the asteroids which are doing the cratering, all consistent with the erosion rates on solar bodies but with no coherent explanation in YEC. There is no true science vs false science, observational vs historical science, there is just YEC at war with science and common sense.
The sedimentary rock strata is inconsistent with what a global flood would produce. Animals that did not die together did not live at the same time - another simple observation that is so self obvious, that it takes considerable deliberate self delusion to evade.
Even if Biologos recanted an ancient earth, and repented of thought and honesty itself, reality would not change one iota to accommodate that, and the planet would just continue orbiting the sun as it has billions of times before.
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You are the one who is promoting cosmology as held in the ancient near east.
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I keep a rock on my desk, given to me by some dear patients originally from Michigan,commonly called a Petoskey stone. It is originally a coral that grew in a shallow tropical sea over many years, then fossilized and turned to a form of limestone when covered by sediment and drifted with the underlying bedrock to a more northerly location, only to be unearthed by glaciers, which then retreated to leave it on the shore of lake to be found. Dated by science at 350 million years old, but presumably those events took place in the eyes of AIG 5000 years ago in the space of a few years.
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