Quoting the title of J.B. Philips’ book: “Your God Is Too Small”. You may want to consider getting out more; clearly, there’s a lot you haven’t seen. Pentecost is coming up on May 23rd, why don’t you try something new; worst case scenario is that you encounter something new that you can say “No” to.
I’m not sure why you don’t think I get out. I have been to dozens snd dozens of different denominations and I routinely read book after book and talk with pastors and evangelists and teachers from different denominations and have debated with others in person at their congregations and ect…
I am positive with no reason to doubt that cessationism is true. It’s what the Bible teaches. It’s what is supported by any and all data. You don’t see a single person in the world that is able to do what the 14 did or those that received the laying on of hands. I’m just as certain if that as I am about baptism, as I am about God and ect…
It’s not close minded. It’s knowing where I stand until proven otherwise. If anyone disagrees then go find the man or woman and bring them to a historical to heal the sick and raise the dead and find me a demon possessed person with supernatural strength breaking chains and speaking with multiple voices. You can’t. It’s not because I lack faith. It’s because I have faith. I have faith in Gods word and that’s what it teaches. The apostles turned the world upside down. Thousands followed then and believed be cause of what they did that was unbelievers. No one is able to do that and no is doing that. I don’t have to go to every Bigfoot convention or Bigfoot sighting and scout the land to know Bigfoot , some ancient evolutionary path of a bipedal giant ape, is not roaming America’s wilderness despite all the stories.
It’s similar to the “witchcraft fear” based around the world. They don’t exist. Palm readers and tarot card readers can’t read the future. No one is able to use their mind to move things or transform into a bird and ect…
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While the extraordinary events get much attention, the regular routine of even biblical events did not typically experience miracles. The book of I Samuel, for instance, specifically mentions that “the word of the Lord was rare…”, and unless I recall correctly, except for prophecies, and the one event where Uzzah was struck dead from touching the ark, there weren’t any miracles that are recorded in the entire reigns of a david and Solomon, and except for God’s various appearances or communications, I don’t recall any miracles whatsoever throughout the life of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob or Joseph.
the miracles are indeed special and unique events to accomplish a special purpose or as a sign to confirm a word of the Lord…
But even throughout biblical history miracles are rare events. just think of some of the most extraordinary people in Biblical history that, apart from God’s direct or indirect communication, did not apparently ever see any miraculous events… Noah, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Joseph, Deborah, Ester, Ruth, David, Solomon, Josiah, Nehemiah, Ezra… Unless I am missing something, there is no record of any of these great biblical figures having witnessed or benefitted from any miraculous events.
A lack of miracles happening today really isn’t that different from the main experience of many, if not most, biblical figures and what was seen in “biblical times”.
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Well, if God decided to communicate with me today, I’d certainly classify that to be a miracle!
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God is often subtle, and speaks in a still, small voice. I think most churches have prayers for the sick, and God can answer those prayers in many, many ways, but usually not in a spectacular display. But people tend to prefer a carnival atmosphere. Some years ago there was this Toronto Airport Ministry where people claimed that God gave them gold teeth and gold fillings. I’m not kidding. It was dubbed “rinse and spit” theology.
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When claiming that the Bible is your authority, I think it’s appropriate to give Book, Chapter, and Verse. Enlighten me.
Strikes me as an odd notion that “the 14” were able to do what they did and that the Shekhinah and Ruach ha-Kodesh are now off in the bushes watching the show, but if Cessationism is your “thing”, have at it.
What? Are you Cessationists’ “Zair Naik”, who challenged a Christian debater to drink a cup of poison in front of a crowd in order to prove Jesus’ assurance was false? Minor observation: Assuming that anyone who is demon possessed has supernatural strength seems unwise, but it’s your house, not mine.
LOL! Go play that game with unbelievers.
Our opinions differ and we’re not going to change our minds. Further exchange is fruitless.
Bottom line: we’re done.
What many, many ways that affect the prognoses? It’s all very Charismatic either way.
All very interesting. After 40 or so so years in medicine, I’ve see miraculous recoveries, but no miracles. Closest was a friend whose child’s malignant tumor disappeared, but statistically about 15-20% of that type of tumor does that. He became a Christian in the process, so maybe that was the real miracle.
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Absolutely. It takes a miracle to be reborn, to have a stony heart made flesh.
Could be finances, medicine, the right diagnosis, the right treatment, and so on.
I’m glad we are done.
If you ever want to know about it I suggest just getting a few books on it. Get a few books countering it. Read through it and see what kinds up. Then whatever conclusion you gather test it and go find evidence , or lack of it, to support your thoughts. That’s what I did and that’s why I am where I am.
You asked for BCV. I don’t have the time to do it again but there should still be several of my posts over the last two years as its own threads and in posts. Eventually I’ll maybe dedicate time to make another thread on it but I have other things first.
Anything rather than actually heal? Which of course would show up in the statistics. As would the others one way or the other. They don’t.
You don’t see how God can answer prayers for healing with doctors, medicine, and the like? Even Ray Charles would have been able to see that. .
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God can work through doctors like you.
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Ah, so God’s general providence is the answer, the same way He provided the bricks on the wall outside my window. And the window. And this keyboard. And the squirrel on the lawn. Both. Trouble is He provides my arthritis too. But then He provides ibuprofen gel!
Quite true indeed and no disagreement, but to the point of the original post, none of these biblical figures experienced the kind of miracle comparable to the healings of Jesus. Those kind of extraordinary events that took place “in the world”, or in nature itself, seem rare if not entirely absent from most biblical figures; major seasons of miraculous events seem only to surround Moses (and Joshua) and Elijah (and Elisha), interesting LT enough the two people that appeared with Christ at the transfiguration. The time of Christ and his apostles are really only the third time in all of biblical history that we have a record of these kinds or degree of extraordinary events.
And thus to the original question…
One additional example occurred to me… in the book of Acts, God miraculously rescue his people from prison not just once, not just twice, but three times.
In theory, I could ask why does there appear to be a lack of miraculous prison breaks today as compared to what was seen in “biblical” times… but then I consider that Joseph, Micaiah, Jehoiachin, Jeremiah, and others may well have some objections to this observation…
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Er, why so?
Reconciliation with the eternal and all powerful God is pretty miraculous, both in concept and mechanism.
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Having a child not die of cancer might have more to do with it than rhetoric.