You say Jesus became sin on the cross and you glory in Jesus on the cross.
While you may view Jesus’ prayer in the garden as a moment of weakness, I do not. He was willing to give His life, but it was not a good thing that happened. Judas and the Jews yelling crucify Him are not applauded heroes of Christianity. Jesus said it would have been better if Judas had never been born. Why would that be, if it was such a good thing that Judas did? When we look at the cross what we should feel is shame not glory or pride. It should call us to repent of our sins because it is our sins which put Him there.
Do I sacrifice my rationality on a pagan alter in order to make a deal with a demon to recite nonsense phrases for the rest of my life in exchange for getting a free pass on my sins? No I do not!
I believe what Paul said, but no I do not agree with how you choose to SAY you interpret it all literally. Did our body cease breathing? No. Are the bodies we have now brand new? obviously not. And I will not stubbornly insist on what is plainly not the case. Therefore these are metaphors and not physically literal no matter how much you insist they are. Can you be reborn without dying to your old life and your sins? No. Is your spirit brought back to life in a living relationship with God? Yes.
Questions for you: Was Matthew 13:25 about agricultural sabotage? Was Matthew 13:47 about fishing? Was Matthew 20 about vineyard management? Was Matthew 22 about how to conduct weddings?
Jesus on the cross is our greatest sin and so yes God holds that up for all to see that we might repent and turn to the righteousness of God, which He has always asked of us.
Your not understanding. I spoke the Word of God, the Spirit convicted him.
At the same time, when I do open air preaching or one on one, if I use the word repent, many times I will also say, change your mind, change your direction, change your actions and turn to Jesus, for He can deliver you from your slavery or bondage to sin and from God’s right judgement on you for the evil things you think, do and say.
Whether you believe it or not, to those I speak to, I am not speaking in a foreign language. They understand me. I talked to a customer yesterday, a young lady. I asked her what she knew about Jesus. She shrugged her shoulders as if saying, “nothing”. I asked her if she has sinned, she said yes. Then I went into different aspects of the Good News. I spoke of different inward sins and outward sinful actions. I associated it with her position in her work, because she brought up work. I told her about Jesus death and it was our death, that I died with Christ. I told her of my sins before the Lord and then how God created a new person of me, literally. I explained the process of how God delivers me from temptation now. And I used a bunch of other “Churchy Language” to explain the Gospel. She did not shy away from my words, ask me to leave but intently listened and thanked me when I left. God’s Spirit was at work there because that is what He was sent to do.
John 16:7-Unless I go away, the Counselor will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. 8 When he comes, he will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment: 9 in regard to sin, because men do not believe in me; 10 in regard to righteousness, because I am going to the Father, where you can see me no longer; 11 and in regard to judgment, because the prince of this world now stands condemned.
I trust what Jesus said, so I preach the Word in season and out and have confidence that the Father, Jesus and the Spirit will do what they said they would do. THAT IS CALLED FAITH IN GOD!
John 3:3- In reply Jesus declared, “I tell you the truth, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again.” 4 “How can a man be born when he is old?” Nicodemus asked. “Surely he cannot enter a second time into his mother’s womb to be born!” 5 Jesus answered, "I tell you the truth, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless he is born of water and the Spirit. 6 Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit.
Why would you bring up our bodies? It is obvious I have always been referring to the spirit of man. It is the spirit of man that literally dies in Christ and is raised to be a New Creation, now, in this life. That is the grace of God. It is that newly created spirit that is righteous because it is born of the Father and it is that righteousness that is actively at work in us saving us moment by moment from the temptations of the flesh. The New Covenant where God writes His laws on our hearts.
I would never firehose an overweight person with Scripture. If and only if the person asked for help I would point the person to resources. Otherwise, it’s none of my business. A “Shock and Awe” bombardment with Scripture for almost any problem does more harm than good. Same deal with controlling what a woman does with her body. Ban it and you’ll drive it underground. What does work to slow the rate of [a-word]s is good social programs and access to birth control.
btw, one guy I admire very much is Nicholas Kristof of the NY Times. He has exposed PornHub and saved many children from being sexually exploited for profit by them. His life is his sermon.
So have you been born again as Jesus stated we must be?
Is Christ in you, your only hope of glory?
Col 1:25 I have become its servant by the commission God gave me to present to you the word of God in its fullness— 26 the mystery that has been kept hidden for ages and generations, but is now disclosed to the saints. 27 To them God has chosen to make known among the Gentiles the glorious riches of this mystery, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory.
I didn’t assume you were talking about overweight people. Lots of people are slaves to food and are not overweight. I was assuming you were concerned about people who were being overcome by their passions of the flesh. I was assuming that, rather than thinking that you were setting me up for a flood of judgmental accusations.
As Dale attempted to explain to you throwing your language at someone is never going to make anything clear. I am not going to change the way I think and speak to fit your preferences. Christianity is not about making everyone think and speak in the same way as you.
That is for God to say not me.
Do I have a sense of entitlement and count salvation as one of my accomplishments in life? I certainly do not! I believe in the gospel taught by Jesus and Paul of salvation by the grace of God not by the accomplishment of men.
No it isn’t. Our spirits are already dead. So that doesn’t work either. To say that Jesus on the cross killed our spirit is just bizarre. It is our sins which do that.
A recap of a previous post where I was boasting in the works of Jesus using members of His body.
I am going to assume that none of you were with Jesus and me when we were at the abortion facilities as a last ditch effort to save the mothers and the babies from the results of sin. I wonder if you know any of the kids that were born from Jesus being there to help them. You just may and not even now it.
I will also assume that you were not around when we were able to preach the Gospel to a federal judge, the police, federal marshals, prison guards, inmates and make a stand on national TV and radio against wickedness and make a call to turn and follow Jesus. (Using Churchy Language)
Where you there on the streets in my local cities when Jesus and I and others went out to compel the lost to come to Jesus for forgiveness and seeing the conviction of sin on some of their faces? (Churchy Language again)
Were you at the whore house when Jesus and I pleaded with them to turn from sin and be forgiven? (You can’t do that Cody, they wouldn’t understand.) Oh! They understood.
I don’t remember seeing you when I spoke to my customers about repentance and faith in God. And did you see the conviction on their faces? I’m sorry. You weren’t there.
Nope! You weren’t there when a young man thanked us for pointing out the sin he was going into when we were at a strip club. You didn’t hear him say with a big smile, “Thank you man, I’m going home to my wife.”
Did you donate any time or money towards the house that Jesus built for a family who lived in a literal shack? Did you help pay for the two used cars He bought for the two daughters of that family? Nope!
The message I declare here is the same message I declare out there. And who would have ever thought that the Spirit of God would be able to convict people of sin, righteousness and judgement as Jesus promised by using Churchy Language (English of course.) I guess I am just a fool for believing Jesus could use a member of His body to do His work.
The Jesus I know willingly was executed in my place, as if it was me there and then I with Him rose from death. And now it is Christ that lives in me.
Rom 8:9- And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ. 10 But if Christ is in you, your body is dead because of sin, yet your spirit is alive because of righteousness. I have been crucified with Christ, never the less I live, yet not I but it’s Christ that lives in me. (That is the Word of God.
Rom 8:9- And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ. 10 But if Christ is in you , your body is dead because of sin, yet your spirit is alive because of righteousness. I have been crucified with Christ, never the less I live, yet not I but it’s Christ that lives in me. (That is the Word of God.
Well, I did mention gluttony, which is overeating. Do you really know slaves to food who are not overweight? How can you tell they are slaves to food? Do they enjoy their food? Do you enjoy eating?
You sure are very interested in other people and their faults and sins and the like. I wouldn’t be surprised if you crawled around at night with a flashlight and peeked into bedrooms to see what your neighbors are doing. You could jump out of the bushes in the morning and confront them if something was wrong!!!
You are correct, I am very interested and concerned about other people who are under the power of sin.
Do you realize, 1 John 5:19 that the whole world is under the control of the evil one.
Gal 3:22 But the Scripture declares that the whole world is a prisoner of sin, so that what was promised, being given through faith in Jesus Christ, might be given to those who believe."
So since the whole world is under the power of sin and the devil, Christ in me compels me to plead, preach, share and explain the Good News about Jesus to them. It is the Spirit of Christ in me going to the lost and compel them to come to Him, just as He did when He was here. And since I have been where they are but now know the power of the death and resurrection of Jesus, I have what they need. But, you see, it’s not me. It’s Christ in me seeking the lost. Just as He promised, He and the Father would come and live in me.
The Good News proclaims that we can be saved. What are we saved from and how does that salvation technically work? What did it take to save us and what is the procees of that salvation?
(Edited info: How does God save us?)
More than that, it proclaims that we have seen God in Jesus, seen the redemption of our sins in Jesus, seen the love of God in Jesus, and seen everlasting life in Jesus.
This is the most important question, to which I add another. From whom are we saved?
ideas: saved from the devil? saved from God?
Correct answer: saved from ourselves. The problem is in ourselves and the problem is the self-destructive habits which we give the name of sin. These are habits contrary to life itself which destroys our potential, our love, our free will, and everything else of value within us. It is a progressive degenerative illness (metaphorically speaking).
God.
God.
God.
Religions like to take these things away from God and put it in their hands instead, to say…
how is what we tell you to do.
what it takes is doing what we say.
the process is following our instructions.
These religions are liars.
But what then is the value of Christianity?
It can show us some of what God has done. …in the Bible. …in Jesus.
Isaiah 43 I, am the Lord, And there is no savior besides Me.
Psalm 19:14 O Lord, my rock and my Redeemer.
Hosea 13:4 I have been the Lord your God
Since the land of Egypt;
And you were not to know any god except Me,
For there is no savior besides Me.
2 Samuel 22 The Lord is my rock and my fortress and my deliverer;
etc… etc… etc…
Does this mean it doesn’t matter what we do? Actually, the question doesn’t even make sense. We are talking about salvation from sin. It is all about changing what we do. So… how then can we say it doesn’t matter what we do? We would only ask that if we didn’t know what we needed to be saved from. Like if we believed lies of the devil that it is God we need to be saved from. Then we might get very confused.
To glory when used in this way is meaningless those outside a narrow group. I see more modern translations use "brag, boast, be proud of, and when used by Paul is first and foremost an expression of personal humility at the realization of Christ’s sacrifice. It is good to try to work things in common language, first to communicate effectively, and second to make sure we understand what we are saying ourselves, not just regurgitating phases.
Let’s go to your last question, “is Jesus in you?” I admit to using that phrase, but it is still difficult to explain in common English to a non-Christian. To me it means having your desires, intentions and actions aligned to the teachings of Jesus, and overlaps with having the Holy Spirit. What does it mean to you as you asked it, Cody? Is that close?
That’s a good point, @jpm. The issue of transubstantiation is a good example of a biblically-illiterate population taking a phrase from scripture at face value.
While Paul encourages us to follow his example, that example also includes becoming all things for all people. While not every person can do that, the Body of Christ can. @Cody_G is equipped by the Holy Spirit to reach people by speaking NKJV, we are all equipped by the Spirit to reach people at different times in different situations. Considering the needs of the person or people before us, whoever our neighbor is, it is humbling to realize that it’s not enough for me to say the right things at people, I have to make sure that I am not treating verses as magic words. Christ was able by to discern needs when he met someone, I am not. I need to set my aspirations aside and listen. Where Cody’s role is to preach the gospel to someone outside of an abortion clinic, maybe my role is supply a crisis pregnancy center with diapers, and someone else will be the answered prayer to take a woman keeping her child to her OB appointments because her family won’t. God’s Word is light and life because not only are they spoken, but they are demonstrated by the church. I love seeing how this is demonstrated by the many experiences and scientific disciplines represented by BioLogos
All this is demonstrating how much of religion is language… or perhaps I should say culture. Churches I have visited each have their own special language – their own localized culture. One Bible… one mediator between God and man, the man Christ Jesus… but many churches… many languages… many cultures.
I have also noticed how often Christians confuse the religion with the culture. A Christian once said to me they would know if a person is a Christian if they met one. How? I insisted I was a Christian even though she said I was not. After all… I had asked Jesus into my life the way the televangelist told me to. What was missing was the language… the culture of it.
Well a great deal has changed since then. With a masters of divinity from seminary I know more about Christianity than most Christians. I know the language of most Christianity, even if I don’t know the language of Cody’s particular group. Though I should say that I am still not fully a part of the Christian culture since I wasn’t raised in it… and I still insist on thinking for myself and understanding it all in my own highly rational way. But I am not the first Christian like that and I will not be the last. One advantage is that I put a lie to the claim of the more foolish atheists that people are only Christian because they were raised that way (plenty of atheists know better of course).
But what can we say of those who confuse Christianity with the language and culture? Many have been incensed here by the idea that religion is mostly language – and the funniest thing about it is that they are the ones who confuse Christianity with the language and culture most. Of course, I don’t think it is JUST language. I am sure they wouldn’t like the idea that it is just culture either. And of course I don’t think Christianity is just culture. But if its essence is other than language and culture then wouldn’t that suggest that those confusing Christianity with the language and culture have lost touch with it to some degree? Perhaps they need someone like me occasionally to show this to them.
If anyone has interest, please read thoroughly. It’s only a taste of the feast God is willing to give to those who love Him and seek for Him with all their heart.
To an unbeliever I normally start out with pointing out things that are sinful. Then I can trust that the Spirit will convince them of their own sins. If I see some light of conviction come on, then I can go into some aspects of the work of salvation that God has done in Christ. I trust the Spirit to do the work he was sent to do as I preach, proclaim, share and explain the Gospel. As I did when I spoke to the guy who wanted to beat me up at the strip joint. I spoke to him about the sin he was involved in and then the situation allowed me to say, “Jesus rose from the dead”. And God used that truth, immediately to effect him and humble him.
The Father, Son, Spirit, prophets and apostles used words to express their thoughts. The terms used are meant to declare and explain those thoughts. If a certain translation is not as good as another for you, than for sure use multiple ones to gain an understanding. But the words that they used are not a religion, they are truth. They reveal God to us and they need to be understood so that we can know God. Do not nullify God’s word by mans wisdom and philosophy.
In reference to my question, “Is Jesus in you?” You asked me " What does it mean to you as you asked it."
To answer your question I will need to use the Word of God, for it is what He says that matters. You asked me what it means, “is Jesus in you”. 1 Cor 6:17 But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit. Col 3:11 but Christ is all, and is in all. 2 Cor 3:17 Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.” When I placed my faith, trust, reliance (I use multiple words to express my point in case one word does not bring a full understanding) wholly in Jesus and confessed my allegiance to Him by calling Him Lord, it was at that moment that the effect of His death and resurrection became effective in me. I was united (literally) with Him through that whole process. I WAS IN CHRIST! I was baptized or immersed into Christ, made one with Him, united to Him. The Word became flesh so that He would be me on the cross. He who knew no sin, BECAME SIN. He went through my execution, my judgment and then resurrected and the whole time I was united with Him in it. So then, the following verses come into effect.
Rom 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. 7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.
Gal 2:20 I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me.
I became united with Jesus. “Now the Lord is the Spirit” and “he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit” and “Christ is all, and is in all.” If I am a part of His body, than who do you think literally lives in that body? If I am born again by the Spirit, whose spirit lives in me, “Now the Lord is the Spirit”, it is the Lord. These are not figures of speech, or metaphors, they are a spiritual reality. I really have died in Christ and been raised from death, now, in this life. I am in truth a member of the body of Jesus and His spirit, Him, lives in me. The mystery that had been hidden from the ages has now been revealed to us by the Spirit, through the apostles, that mystery is, “ Christ in you, the hope of glory ”.
This is how God works His salvation in those who trust in Jesus. He executes us, judges us and raises us up and it is all done by our union with Christ. This is the central aspect of the Gospel. It is through the body and blood of Christ that was offered up by the Spirit that we are cleansed. Heb 9:14 How much more, then, will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself unblemished to God, cleanse our consciences from acts that lead to death, so that we may serve the living God!
Heb 10:5 5 Therefore, when Christ came into the world, he said: “Sacrifice and offering you did not desire, but a body you prepared for me; 6 with burnt offerings and sin offerings you were not pleased. 7 Then I said, ‘Here I am — it is written about me in the scroll — I have come to do your will, O God.’”
By placing all my trust in Jesus, I was united to Him, and my old man was crucified, I was circumcised (separated) from the flesh, and I was raised up a New Creation in Christ. This all happens to the spirit of a person when they repent (turn) and subjugate themselves to Jesus. The Father unites us with Jesus.
Salvation from sin and God’s righteous judgment on us for our rebelliousness is dealt with through the cross of Christ. And being united to Jesus causes me to die to sin and this world and made alive in Jesus. That is the way God worked our salvation. Our salvation from the power of sin, the devil and death was brought into the present in us through “the Lamb of God that takes away the sins of the world”.
When a person is Born Again, their newly created spirit is righteous, Eph 4:24 “and that you put on the new man which was created according to God, in true righteousness and holiness .” That New Creation is united to Jesus, one spirit; those who believe are the body of Christ because Christ lives in them. It is that true righteousness and holiness of God that is birthed into our spirits that delivers us from the day to day temptations. As scripture says, “He is at work both to will and do His good pleasure”. He is in us, leading, teaching, guiding, and empowering us to live a holy life free from the power of sin. Those who have died in Christ have died to sin and the righteousness of God now lives in us.
So with so great a salvation that God has worked for us through the cross, body and blood of Christ, we need to seriously take the warning, Heb 10:29 How much more severely do you think a man deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God under foot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified him, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him who said, “It is mine to avenge; I will repay,” and again, “The Lord will judge his people.” 31 It is a dreadful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.”
1 Cor 2:6 We do, however, speak a message of wisdom among the mature, but not the wisdom of this age or of the rulers of this age, who are coming to nothing. 7 No, we speak of God’s secret wisdom, a wisdom that has been hidden and that God destined for our glory before time began. 8 None of the rulers of this age understood it, for if they had, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory. 9 However, as it is written: “No eye has seen,no ear has heard,no mind has conceived what God has prepared for those who love him”— 10 but God has revealed it to us by his Spirit. The Spirit searches all things, even the deep things of God. 11 For who among men knows the thoughts of a man except the man’s spirit within him? In the same way no one knows the thoughts of God except the Spirit of God. 12 We have not received the spirit of the world but the Spirit who is from God, that we may understand what God has freely given us. 13 This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, expressing spiritual truths in spiritual words. 14 The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned. 15 The spiritual man makes judgments about all things, but he himself is not subject to any man’s judgment: 16 “For who has known the mind of the Lord that he may instruct him?” But we have the mind of Christ. ”
So, will it take some renewing of your mind by washing it with the Word of God to understand this; yes it will. Will it take asking God to teach you; yes. With this reality of what God did through Jesus, is there any wonder I encourage those who say they love Jesus, to not get involved in carnal, fleshly, worldly, godless so called entertainment. With the death of this body just around the corner and judgment beyond that, what manner of life should we be living.
Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men. 12 It teaches us to say “No” to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age, 13 while we wait for the blessed hope — the glorious appearing of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ, 14 who gave himself for us to redeem us from all wickedness and to purify for himself a people that are his very own, eager to do what is good.
15 These, then, are the things you should teach. Encourage and rebuke with all authority. Do not let anyone despise you.
God bless all who have turned away from the love of this present world and who long for the return of our Lord and Savior, Jesus the Son of God.
