According to Jesus, narrow is the path that leads to life and few find it. Few saved vs many condemned.
James 4:17 NIV If anyone, then, knows the good they ought to do and doesn’t do it, it is sin for them.
Is this willful sin okay for a believer? Also, what is the difference between living in sin vs sinning occasionally? And how does it work when a sinner also does good works? For example, someone who does missionary and also evangelizing for Jesus but also commits sexual sins. Do the ongoing sins prove the person is not saved or do the good works prove genuine salvation? Where’s that balance?
What would you say? Good question… I mean about the man’s heart.
I think the New Testament makes life a sin. Consider Jesus teaching in Matthew where you ought not resist an evil doer, or give to everyone who asks of you or in Luke 14:33 teaching to give up all possessions. This makes normal life impossible. How does a normal person even “strive” to do these things without lying to themselves?
Sin is what robs us of life. Rescuing us from our sin is what makes life possible. The whole Billie Joel schtick about “I’d rather laugh with the sinners than cry with the saints” only shows that Billy Joel doesn’t know a real party when he sees one. There is rarely more delightful (and delighted) laughter than when one is fellowshipping (partying) with the saints. Yes - they are willing to mourn with each other and everybody else too - in a heartbeat as may be called for. But their joy is never held hostage to all that which would try to rob us of any lasting joy. And evil is not fun or edifying or wholesome or life-giving - as every one of us can attest during those times when we’ve given in to that. Sure, some of it gives immediate, or surface pleasure by mimicking good things that God has created, but the immediate sweet taste turns out to be bitter fruit in all the life to follow. Wisdom is known by her fruit.
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He meant life now. While you’re alive. There is no condemnation in Christ Jesus: His faithfulness will save all. Without torture.
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I forgot to mention Jesus saying where some people become eunuchs for the kingdom of God. Thankfully he did not command this, but he did not condemn the practice either. I get the impression that the God of the Bible wasn’t much interested in our enjoyment of life.
Why? And why would you think the passage on eunuchs has any relevance for this? Not only is Jesus not commanding it - he’s not even suggesting it. He’s only making an observation that “some are this way” and “some are that” and going on to note that “some can accept this and some can’t.” In fact, he had just finished teaching: “what God has brought together, let man not separate.” Hardly a ringing endorsement for celibacy. [You’ll fare better with Paul if you want to try painting God as a kill-joy for all sex.]
Against your notion of God as a kill-joy, I suggest the old testament commands: “taste and see that the Lord is good” as well as Jesus’ life example of eating with people, both common meals as well as at feasts and festivals. He even was okay with seeing that the wine didn’t run out on at least one occasion.
Point well taken. But there’s a different side, telling disciples to sell all possessions in Luke 14:33, and in Matthew teaching to turn the other cheek, not resist evildoers and give to everyone who asks of you.
Getting destroyed in a lake of fire doesn’t sound like honoring my choice.
Do you think every Hindu is evil in their hearts and deserves to be destroyed for believing in what they think is a true religion?
I would think that it would be up to use to change our own hearts. If not, it is God who decides who is saved and there is nothing we can do about it.
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Nope. God is just. He cannot allow sin into his presence, and Jesus didn’t come to give life to rebels who will not change. Your fate is what you choose.
But it is. It seems some would rather die than to serve another, even if that is God.
I have no idea. Are you saying that no Hindu can ever be converted and believe in Jesus? I think that has already happened many times.
And there lies the conundrum. Nobody seeks God unless he first calls them. Nobody. What we can do is to answer when he calls and seek him in return.
Remember the crimes. This person killed people in the cruelest ways. If allowed, he will kill again and again. There is only one possible penalty: Death. Think of it as the old west. There will be no rehab, no mental facility, no insanity plea.
Love and justice are separate issues. You might love what your child was, but love for others means he can never go free to kill again.
God’s love and mercy do not run out, but his justice must be met. No sin can ever enter God’s presence.
Nope. God is just. He ensures equality of outcome for all in the faithfulness of His Son. Your fate in rebellion to that is assured by His choice.
I used to think that way too. I’ve since become convinced this can’t be true of God’s character. He doesn’t “change hats” or set aside his love for a moment so that he can be just; or set his justice aside so that he can be loving. He is always and simultaneously both - in perfection. In fact - I think that ultimately, Love and Justice are inseparable. To lose one is to lose the other. God is a just God precisely because he is a loving Father. And he is loving with his justice. It would not be justice otherwise. The God shown us in Christ can be nothing less than all of that.
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Right.
Punishment is not vindictive in a good parent. It is corrective. As we have discussed, C S Lewis and George Macdonald argue that well in “Mere Christianity” and “Justice.”
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Exactly. He cannot ignore sin, and sin cannot survive in his presence. People who think that his love for everyone means that he will not punish sin appropriately are completely wrong.
Correction is not punishment.
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Some things can’t be corrected. Some people will not be corrected. Fortunately, that is up to God to deal with at his time.
If Jesus is God then the story of his intervention on behalf of the prostitute should make you reconsider your position. Better than lose your place in happiness over a failure to love a neighbor. Judging others may or may not be God’s work but it shouldn’t be his followers who are over eager to hand out consequences here and now.
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