New Blog Post: 5 reasons Christians should get the COVID-19 vaccine

Intro: “eh, you probably had COVID already” dice roll

Let’s say your interpolation of the CDC study range is correct and there really were 143.6 million people infected in the country so far. The biggest problem with that is… 110 of those million people don’t have evidence that they were infected with COVID-19. Should those people just assume they are protected against future outbreaks based upon no evidence but a probability from a computational estimate? I don’t think that’s a good plan of action.

Common sense is not a reliable tool to judge things

Please don’t judge things based off of your “common sense.” That is not a great way to go about evaluating much of anything, but let’s go on. For example, while there could have been some reasons to think people who were infected have some protection against future infections, here is a short blog post before various immunity studies came in outlining some research on the short-lived nature of immunity to some seasonal coronaviruses:

Natural immunity and vaccine immunity

Okay, that’s good for most individuals who have evidence of prior infection. But that amounts to only 10% of our population and again you run into the problem of not knowing who actually has protection. You also have some 5% of people as per the study you linked that do not have strong protection after prior infection.

That is a good result and in line with some other studies. Here is an early one from Denmark:

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)00575-4/fulltext

Here prior infection was 80% effective at preventing disease the second round, but if you were over 65, this dropped to less than 50%. These numbers are worse than vaccines which is part of why there’s still a recommendation for at least one shot after a confirmed COVID-19 diagnosis. Unless someone has evidence of having COVID-19, they should still get fully vaccinated.

Here is also a timely comparison from NIH director, Francis Collins, about how variants might play a role in the difference between vaccines and prior infection:

The misinformation over vaccine safety

I am not sure what kind of background you have in statistics or epidemiology as you rattle off statistics on “vaccine-related deaths,” comparing this season to previous years and remarkably claim that 16 times more people die from the COVID-19 vaccine as the flu vaccine. It looks like a few others have chimed in with your abuse of the VAERS database so far so I won’t touch upon that.

You also make misleading statements like:

This is misleading for multiple reasons, starting with the obvious that you clearly aren’t familiar with typical vaccine production and testing timelines and why many times they can take over a decade. Please go learn about that before commenting more.

Kids can die, and get long COVID, and the vaccine is still safer

Really? The likelihood of children dying is not zero and you even posted links showing how some 50,000 kids 0-4 were hospitalized with COVID-19 (my friend’s son nearly died thank you very much) and 140,000 some children aged 5-17. That’s about one in every 390 infected children will be hospitalized if they get the virus.

This is also highly misleading because this is with many health precautions in place. This is not a “life as normal” thing. Plus, much transmission from kids occurs within households, where there are often more vulnerable people.

Again, let’s say we can attribute all of this to vaccines… it’s still much better than an actual COVID-19 infection for even youth (from a recent ACIP meeting):

In closing, all children should consider getting vaccinated for COVID-19:

And the American Academy of Pediatrics recent recommendation:

https://services.aap.org/en/news-room/news-releases/aap/2021/statement-following-cdc-acip-meeting-from-nations-leading-doctors-nurses-and-public-health-leaders/

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Jpm. Your first observation is incredibly disingenuous. Yes, 97% of current infections are unimmunized. What percentage are infected/recovered? According to Dr. Makary, “The number of daily cases of COVID are 1/50th the number of daily cases of flu in the middle of a mild flu season.” The thrust of my argument was that infected/recovered don’t need to be vaccinated. I said nothing about those who have never been infected (though I still feel strongly that children shouldn’t get these, period).

The studies I offered show exactly what I intended them to: infected/recovered have superior immune response (not just antibody production, but immune memory via B-cells, etc). It lasts longer (perhaps a lifetime). What more do you want?

How many young people/children die of influenza each year? We don’t demand they get a flu shot. The number will never be zero deaths in any demographic group. Even with vaccination for that matter. Is the risk of adverse reactions from the vaccines worth it?

We aren’t here to host anti-vaccine propaganda. It’s flagged because it’s misinformation. I’m still debating whether to just delete the whole mess.

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It’s not propaganda Christy. Those who have been infected/recovered don’t need to be vaccinated. I’ve offered studies in support of that conclusion. The vaccines have hurt people. I’ve offered evidence to that effect as well. I never said that NOBODY should get it, and I’m not an anti-vaccer. But I’m against this idea that every last person on the planet (even 6 month-olds) must get it.

What you’ve offered is faulty reasoning and poor statistic interpretation in support of a dangerous conclusion.

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References. As neither the vaccine nor the disease has been around that long, your claims are unsubstantiated, and even if disease immunity it longer lasting, are you happy to have death, disability and and slowed economy continue to be the price paid for that immunity when a much safer alternative (the vaccine) exists? Even if boosters are needed, it is a small price to pay for a return to normalcy.

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The entirety of the second prong of your argument was based on a completely incorrect understanding of VAERS data. That is 100% propaganda and misinformation.

Vinnie

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You are posting links (which I am going to delete) to Vaccine Impact and Health Impact News, which very much are websites dedicated to pseudoscience quackery.

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Almost everyone dying of Covid-19 in the U.S. is unvaccinated, The Associated Press reports.

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The amount of information omitted inside this blog post concerns me. Haarsma attests that the vaccines have passed vigorous safety tests, but in reality these vaccines are not FDA approved; they are experimental drugs. Because of the rush to produce these vaccines, furthermore, the possible long term effects that these vaccines may have on people is relatively unknown. Haarsma also states that “[t]he good news is that no vaccines contain human cells!”. This statement could not be further from the truth, vaccines that use human cells in their production may be purified, but they will still hold onto residual quantities, meaning vaccines do contain human DNA. The statement “immortal cell line” proves quite misleading as well. No cell line is immortal. According to Hayflick’s limit, the amount of times a cell can replicate and divide is limited. Once it reaches its limit it has to be replaced with a different cell strain. The creation of one cell strain, furthermore, often requires many abortions and experiments before the desired cell strain can be obtained. In addition to that, Haarsma also makes the statement that “[y]et even here, the cells used today are descended many generations from the original fetus and were never part of an actual human body”. A fetus is a human, therefore, cells taken from a fetus are cells taken from “an actual human body”. Haarsma finishes her blog with the idea that since we have all seen the destructive forces of Covid-19 for ourselves we should know that the vaccine is safer than the disease. She states that “[t]he risks of the vaccine are less than the risks of the disease,” yet the vaccine is an experimental drug, the risks are still relatively unknown.

Your post was flagged because it is riddled with misinformation. Please don’t come here and spread rumors you heard on Facebook. Here are some fact checks.

  1. The vaccines available in the US, Pfizer, Moderna, and Johnson and Johnson are all FDA approved. “Experimental drugs” refers to drugs that are still in various stages of clinical trials. The clinical trials of all the vaccines were completed before they were granted authorization for use on the public.
  1. The vaccines have been administered to millions of people at this point that the side effects are indeed well-known, they are not long-term, and the idea that vaccines can cause side effects that show up years later is bogus.
  1. COVID vaccines do not contain human DNA, nor will they alter your DNA. Vaccines that contain trace amounts of human DNA are chickenpox, rubella, and hepatitis A.

https://www.chop.edu/centers-programs/vaccine-education-center/vaccine-ingredients/fetal-tissues

  1. You have failed to grasp the concept of fetal cell lines. The cells used in testing (Moderna and Pfizer) and growing (J&J) the vaccines were not taken from a fetus. They were taken from a culture of cells in a lab (not a human body) and grown in a lab.
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Thanks for the feedback, always appreciate others ideas when it comes to this topic. Have to say I don’t have a Facebook account nor have I ever, so your assumptions are quite interesting. My bad for not clarifying that the vaccines are only certified for emergency use and not everyday use. Which means that the FDA has only approved the vaccines because it is an emergency. During emergency use the FDA expects the manufacturers to continue clinical trials to obtain more information on the safety of the vaccine during its emergency use. The FDA also expects the manufacturers to pursue licensure approval. Because again, they are only authorized for emergency use and clinical trials are still occurring to conclude additional information. So In a way yes, they are experimental drugs, well experimental vaccines to be specific. If they were not experimental then they would be fully approved. Also I never said that the Covid vaccines contain human DNA, I was responding to the blog which states that no vaccines contain human DNA, some vaccines do. I also never said anything about the residual DNA in vaccines changing your own DNA, but if you mean to say that the Covid vaccines don’t change your DNA then perhaps you could explain to me how a Mrna vaccine operates. The fetal cell line I was referring to was the one mentioned in the blog, the Johnson & Johnson’s vaccine.

Wherever you get your information, it’s unreliable. There are fact check articles for almost every sentence of your posts.

Not quite. Obviously emergency approval is granted only in emergencies and it allows certain timelines to be sped up. But it doesn’t mean that the vaccines themselves are inferior and would be incapable of getting approved under normal circumstances. It just would have taken longer.

https://www.fda.gov/vaccines-blood-biologics/vaccines/emergency-use-authorization-vaccines-explained

All the COVID vaccines approved for emergency use had completed their required clinical trials through Phase 3.

Not true. The accurate thing to say is that if there was not a pandemic, they would not have been approved so quickly. But no steps were skipped in the development or testing.
H/T @pevaquark

The vaccine companies are completing the steps to get full approval. Pfizer applied at the end of May and it is expected to be fully approved later this year.

Vaccines work because they inject a harmless part of a pathogen into your body to trigger a similar immune response that your body would have if you were actually infected with the disease. Usually vaccines use weakened or dead bacteria or viruses. MRNA vaccines use mRNA instead of part of the actual virus. MRNA is like a blueprint cells use to make proteins. Once the protein is made, the mRNA gets broken down by the cell. It never enters the nucleus of the cell (where the organism’s DNA is) so there is no way mRNA from a vaccine could alter an organism’s DNA.

The mRNA in the vaccine corresponds to protein found on the virus’s outer membrane. (So you can’t get the virus from the vaccine, because it doesn’t contain the virus.) Cells produce the viral protein using the vaccine’s mRNA blueprint. This triggers the body’s normal immune response, which recognizes that the protein is foreign and the body produces antibodies for this protein, which remain in the body. If that protein shows up in the body again (because it has been infected with the virus) it will be recognized and destroyed before it multiplies enough to cause illness.

The article did not say no vaccines contain human DNA. It said:

The good news is that no vaccines contain human cells! Moreover, the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines do not use human cells even in the production process.

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This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.

The sampling sizes of the volunteer testing groups were substantially larger than typical test groups to compensate for the reduced time frame in which the tests were conducted.
The long term impact from the virus is being studied. Some indications suggest cognitive interference but it is very early to say with certainty. This virus is a year and a half old. Scientists don’t have sufficient data to draw firm conclusions, yet, although it appears damage may be more serious than estimated originally.

And whatever the result of long-term studies of recovered COVID patients and vaccine trial participants, it seems pretty clear at this point that the long-term “side effects” of COVID are projected to be far more serious and potentially debilitating than “side-effects” of the vaccine.

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That is my understanding. The testing was done professionally, carefully, observed and monitored properly and the results were clear. Nothing is perfectly safe and no one in a professional capacity promises otherwise. Given what is known about the dangers Covid, the benefits of the vaccines outweigh their risks substantially.
We not only protect ourselves through vaccination, we are protecting others.

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The typical side effects are what you would get from COVID anyway, but far milder. Even the myocarditis and pericarditis that may be associated with the vaccine are appearing to self resolve. Far better to get it mildly from the vaccine than acutely with COVID and permanent heart damage likely.

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I’m two hour away from getting my shot, and I’m terrified. These threads aren’t helping me.

I may postpone it again and read more.

Why? You’re more likely to be hurt driving to get your shot than you are from the shot itself.

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