I’m doing research for a writing project and just discovered this forum today, along with an old conversation that mentions an age of 6,000 years for Mitochondrial Eve. There was also a passing reference to 5,000 years for the age of the father of all fathers. If we are going to use the name Eve from the Bible for the mother of all mothers, we should refer to the most recent father of all fathers as Noah, not Adam. The 17th-century calculations that place creation at about 6,000 years ago also place the flood at about 2348 BC, and Genesis states that Noah was 600 years old when the flood came, making him about 5,000 years old today. I’m interested if anyone can point me to genetic data and analysis that indicates this possible agreement between a literal reading of Genesis and modern genetic research. Thank you.
Welcome to the forum, Lauston! Good to have your voice here. You raise some good questions that have been addressed in the past, and you can probably use the search function to find those discussions.
Note that BioLogos, and most of the regular participants here are of the old earth persuasion, and are unlikely to think the research indicates a 6000 year old earth and a 5000 year old Noah, nor do I. As I understand it, both the mitochondrial Eve and the Y- Chromosomal Adam or Noah, are much further back in time, and did not live in the same time as well. I’ll do a little searching for you, but would encourage you to use the search function for forum discussions, and also on the main website for articles relating to these topics.
It would be helpful to hear a bit about your assignment, as well as your background and level of school to better answer your questions.
Blessings,
Phil
Here are a couple of articles on the main site that do a great job of giving background from an ancient earth evolutionary perspective, and the science behind it:
https://biologos.org/series/evolution-basics/articles/mitochondrial-eve-and-y-chromosome-adam
https://biologos.org/articles/mitochondrial-eve-y-chromosome-adam-and-reasons-to-believe
Current estimates based on genetic data:
Mitochondrial Eve = 155,000 years ago
Y chromosome Adam = 200,000 to 300,000
It is also worth mentioning that neither of these common ancestors would be the sole ancestors of humanity. They each would have been part a population of humans, and their title of Y-chromosome Adam or Mitochondrial Eve would not have been bestowed on them for 10’s or 100’s of thousands of years after their death.
Why is that? The easiest way to understand this is to look at your own ancestry. Mitochondria are only passed on from your mother, so your mitochondrial DNA is from an unbroken line of mothers inheriting their mother’s mitochondrial DNA. If you go back 3 generations in your own ancestors your mitochondrial DNA would have come from just 1 of your 4 great grandmothers. However, your full genome is a mixture of DNA from all your great grandparents.
Thank you for your quick response. My project is not an assignment. I’m working on a book. As for education, I dropped out of college in my sophomore year after my dad died, but I earned a two-year certificate in liberal studies from a community college after I retired. (They give credit for classes in which you received at least a C in previous accredited schools, and tuition is half off for seniors.)
One challenge in writing is knowing your audience. I’m seeking to include both young earthers and old earthers, if possible.
Thank you. Yes, I’m familiar with that perspective.
I am unaware of any other published estimates in the scientific literature that comes close to the numbers you quote in the opening post. I am assuming you are getting those numbers from creationist websites?
If you want to give your readers a bad scientific explanation of the evidence, then I guess you could repeat what is on the creationist websites. However, if you want an honest scientific analysis in your book then the creationist sites aren’t the way to go.
A great deal of DNA, modern and ancient, has been sequenced and the results are wholly incompatible with a Mitochondrial Eve or Y-chromosome Adam anywhere near as recent as 6,000 years. DNA from ancient Egyptians and many other sites reveal an already great extent of variation, known as haplogroups, from that time frame, and Denisovan and Neanderthal DNA diverged from homo sapiens sapiens long long prior. If by a literal reading of Genesis you mean the Usshur chronology, it is delusional to entertain any possible agreement.
The other challenge, of course, is knowing your material. If you are writing a book, hopefully you do not wish to spread falsehood. That requires honest research and not just confirmation seeking. Genetics is not a quick and easy field of study, so you are looking at a fair deal of homework.
“Perspective” is not appropriate as it implies an anything goes subjectivity. The results of genetic studies are based on real world measurable data which support conclusions with a high degree of confidence.
Most of the time when I hear these arguments it’s more focused on a genealogical , not a genetic , focus. You may possibly get more out of “Peaceful Science” than Biologos. The majority here don’t read genesis literal.
There is little hope of salvaging a literal Genesis this way. If you want to be able to accept Adam and Eve, original sin and a flood that essentially killed all humans save Noah and company, the only real way is through genealogical means with a rational soul being introduced at some point.
Vinnie