"Is Atheism Dead" Book Reviews?

Thanks Mervin. No stones here!! I don’t know that you are the one to derail things. I think people just wanted to ride the rails to another stop, rather than a particular book by a man whose politics they maybe do not like. I thought only YECs did that!! Guess not.

And yes, the book COULD have been the focus of more discussion, rather than throwing brickbats (or similar) at it. It did have some intriguing points to it. There were a couple things that I had questions about. But no room here for THAT cuz…well…

All’s well that ends in a mess, I suppose!!

Thanks for stepping in.

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We’ll, I’m certainly guilty of prejudging this particular author right now. So if that is causing me to miss out on salient issues or about something being said that has not been adequately considered, then I do want to be called out about whatever that is. So I do intend to keep my ears open here to what others who have observed who may not be as put off by Metaxas. We need all sorts of different lights here, so thanks for being part of that.

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Surprise surprise…well, you do have company…found this online. Just an excerpt from an article on churches or individuals and groups in Nazi Germany who “de-Nazified” the Bible and tried to re-cast Jesus in a fashion that they found palatable. This relates more to the final paragraph of your comment above — that is, about “certain German theologians…” etc…

This has little to do with the overall topic here. You could say that “some” theologians put personal bigotry before biblical teaching or nationalism before the Biblical instruction on conduct and life. Both are possible and we do it today…just in different venues. We are dropping Mervin’s issue here but that only means that I have said my piece. It really is unfair to just label “one” side of the political spectrum as somehow willing to attach to dictators. The individuals who tried to “de-Judaize” the Bible in their day are doing no different than what we so easily do in our day when it does not suit…including some moral issues… Not a right wing thing — or exclusively from the left either!!

Below is from di0.creation.com…hope I got the site correct. Article is titled “Did Nazis Rewrite the Bible?” by Russell Griggs…and is a product of Creation.com

Find it online and read the whole of it…I just copied and pasted something here to be scandalous. (It’s what I do.)
“The institute shifted Christian attention from
the humanity of God to the divinity of man: Hitler
as an individual Christ, the German Volk as a
collective Christ, and Christ as Judaism’s deadly
opponent” (pp. 164–165).
Reaction of the Nazis
The Institute’s perverse attempt to marry Christianity
to Nazism was not reciprocated by the Nazis, who were
deeply suspicious of all things Christian,2 [this is something I pointed out elsewhere…Nazism sought state religion or Germanic deities not Christianity]
and prohibited
the display of Nazi regalia inside churches. The Nazis
tolerated the Institute, “though its efforts were at times
mocked” (p. 148), and they kept it under secret surveillance
by the intelligence arm of the SS (p. 149).3
In March 1943,
they confirmed their lack of sympathy for Grundmann by
drafting him into military service on the dreaded Eastern
Front (p. 161).
At the end of the war, Grundmann was captured and
was incarcerated in a Soviet prisoner of war camp. He was
released on medical grounds in October 1945, and was
among the first to return home. The Thuringian church
closed the Institute that year (pp. 249–250).
Grundmann then campaigned for rehabilitation, mostly
by soliciting letters of personal testimony in his favour from
previous like-minded pro-Nazi ‘Christians’, who continued
to support each other after the war. He disingenuously
“presented himself as an objective scholar who had fallen
victim to Nazi attacks as a result of his efforts on behalf
of Christianity and his scholarship” (p. 253). In the 1950s,
having gone through a ‘soft’ de-Nazification (i.e. without
being held to account), he was appointed rector of the
Thuringian seminary in Eisenach, which was now part of
East Germany. From 1956 he served the communists as a
secret informer for Stasi (the State Security Service of East
Germany), supplying information about his opponents in
the Confessing Church (pp. 256 ff.)…

Grundmann, Darwinism, and Mein Kampf
The Germany that Grundmann grew up in was
impregnated with Darwinism. Translations of Darwin’s
Origin of Species had been published in Germany in 1860,
1863, 1867, 1876 and 1916, and his Descent of Man in
1875. Also, Darwinism had become enormously popular
in educated German circles due inter alia to the writings
of Ernst Haeckel, famous (or rather infamous) for his
forged embryo drawings.4,5
Hitler imbibed this Darwinist
philosophy of the strong eliminating the weak, and
regurgitated it in his autobiography, Mein Kampf (meaning
‘My Struggle’). For example, Hitler wrote,
“He who does not wish to fight in this world,
where permanent struggle is the law of life, has not
the right to exist.”6
“The stronger must dominate and not mate with
the weaker, which would signify the sacrifice of
its own higher nature. Only the born weakling can
look upon this principle as cruel, and if he does so
it is merely because he is of a feebler nature and
narrower mind; for if such a law did not direct the
process of evolution then the higher development
of organic life would not be conceivable at all
[Emphasis added].”7
“If Nature does not wish that weaker individuals
should mate with the stronger, she wishes even less
that a superior race should intermingle with an
inferior one; because in such a case all her efforts,
throughout hundreds of thousands of years, to
establish an evolutionary higher stage of being [i.e. referring to recent human evolution], may thus be
rendered futile [Emphasis added].”8
As a passionate pro-Nazi, who regarded Hitler as
‘God’s agent’, Grundmann undoubtedly would have read
Mein Kampf, as some 6 million copies had been sold by
1940. He would therefore have been aware that Hitler’s aim
of eliminating everything Jewish from Germany, including
the Jewish population, was an outworking of the theory
of evolution, aka social Darwinism. Way back in 1941,
Grundmann may or may not have thought his way through
to the ultimate truth that the atheistic, long-age theory

Would you care to tell us the intriguing bits? I have read the section on water and wasn’t impressed, but then I don’t find fine tuning arguments to be persuasive.

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Oddly enough Nazi Germany banned " Writings of a philosophical and social nature whose content deals with the false scientific enlightenment of primitive Darwinism and Monism" (Die Bücherei 2:6 (1935); https://web.archive.org/web/20150216133525/http://www.library.arizona.edu/exhibits/burnedbooks/documents.htm)

Hitler believed that the ‘desirable race’, Aryans, be kept for breeding while the others culled. That is standard farming practice for animals and had been around for millennia; Hitler and other eugenicists just applied it to humans. Something else that predated Darwin were laws prohibiting interracial marriage. America had miscegenation laws starting in the late 1600s.

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Thanks Erp…America was not a nation in the late 1600s…and who was that guy that married Pocahantas?..thanks for the other references on books burned or banned (or both).

As for Aryans…I think that was a joke even in the 1930s. Aryans are not Europeans to begin with, so I guess “so much for Hitler’s deep knowledge of heritage.”

Not sure how this is fitting in with Darwin, or Is Atheism Dead…but interesting nonetheless.

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America wasn’t a nation but the colonies existed and were passing laws. Note the earliest miscegenation laws were strictly against white/black interracial marriages and postdated the Pocahontas/John Rolfe marriage by decades. Later when Virginia did pass one (1924) that expanded the concept of ‘colored’ to include Native Americans, Asians, etc. and anyone who had ancestor who was such, a sole exception was made that having no more than 1/16th Native American and the rest ‘caucasian’ made you white legally (this was to avoid quite a few eminent Virginian families who claimed descent from Pocahontas from suddenly becoming ‘colored’, this exception apparently upset some strict eugenicists). Hitler allegedly quite admired the US eugenics laws.

Thanks for the insights. Erp. Not sure how this relates to “Is Atheism Dead?” or to the subsequent issue about dictatorial tendencies. Reeeeallllllyy off topic…though interesting. And btw, since we are off topic, hope you changed your clocks!! Have a good Sunday.

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Will get back to you. And btw, thanks for asking.

Robin, is this the first book you’ve read by Metaxas? Have you looked at his website? Are you aware of his political views? I’ve read a number of his other works; he’s writes in excellent prose, but my opinion of his work is built on his scattered approach to research and his political views. I don’t sense a desire - it may exist - on his part to understand an opposing viewpoint.

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creation.com ? That certainly inspired confidence in the quality of the article.

I have posted this article before:

The good White Christian women of Nazi Germany
Despite what you’ve read, most of them didn’t resist.

This article, by D.L. Mayfield, appeared in a recent issue of The Christian Century

But even more chilling is this lecture from the National Library of Israel:

How Jesus became a Nazi: Christian Theologians in the Third Reich

The speaker is Prof. Susannah Heschel

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Then try BigThink.com. The point is same in either source.

The original question (not original) was whether authoritarian regimes are the darling of right-wing people,…not left wing.

Nope…both go for them or not…and the original charge — by someone’s teenaged son – is good for a high school debate course but not legit as a point anywhere else in life.

And I suggest you read The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich by William Shirer since this other subject seems to be your interest. See BigThink excerpt below


Share Nazis created an anti-Semitic Bible and Aryan Jesus on LinkedIn

The rise of the Nazis in the 20th century was a horrific byproduct of political, economic, and social tensions of the day. It was also rooted in often esoteric and devious spiritual influences and practices, with Nazi philosophers actively attempting to rewrite history and the world’s established moral order.

As Jews were being scapegoated and obsessively pursued across the Third Reich, an effort was made by Nazi leaders and theologians to turn the story of Jesus into anti-Semitic propaganda. An organization was set up for the express purpose of inventing an Aryan Jesus and writing a Nazi Bible.

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Yes, this is the first book I have read by him. I have heard some of his radio blurbs from time to time. He speaks well. As for his website, I have not paid attention to it. I did look into a link that someone on this site posted. This was one that had Metaxes speaking rather optimistically about the results of the Nov 2020 election. But he spoke in Nov 2020 and I do hope he has calmed down since then. No one likes to lose elections — pretty sure that is true. And I just heard a couple left-wing ideologues today talking about stolen elections or the danger of the “right” stealing the next one. We are worse than a room full of two-year-olds fighting over a toy, are we not? Jan 6, 2021 was enough for me…BUT I wanted to read a book by Metaxes. Nope, not worried that he has Greek ancestry either.

Ha, I’d find that background interesting! Maybe the blood of the philosophers…I have no such luck.

I used his material for a review of C S Lewis’ “Mere Christianity.” That was pre-pandemic, in our Sunday School–and it was quite helpful and balanced. People do tend to act a bit out of character (maybe larger than life) on talk shows.

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Sure…it is interesting…also not holding it against him that he lives in NYC …his blurbs on the radio are good.

Hello Bill…It’s Sunday, the day of rest. And you wanted to know some of the points I liked in Metaxes’ book Is Atheism Dead…

There were quite a few things that I underlined and/or put asterisks by…such as (hardback copy) page 18, the first full paragraph. This is the one wherein he noted that Einstein did not like Lemaitre’s “primeval atom hypothesis” because it was “inspired by the Christian dogma of creation”…Metaxes goes on to note that this dogma actually comes from “the Hebrew dogma of creation too”. Liked the rest of that paragraph…His subsequent remarks on, or quotes from, Sandage are interesting. Never heard of this person before so it is a nice introduction to that individual’s writing or thinking.

His quote from Hitchens, page 35, where he (according to the quote) asserted that the fine-tuning argument was a tough one and noting that they (presumably his fellow New Atheist public debaters) all spent time thinking about how to refute that argument because “It’s not a trivial [argument].”

So if you don’t find the fine tuning argumennts “persuasive,” I don’t know what to say. Evidently Hitchens and some of his NA buds struggle to overcome them…which means…that in their heart of hearts, they are a stumper, presumably.

I could go on. The quote from Hawking (p 56 of the book) and other statistics like that…anything with tons of digits to the right of a decimal point is toooooo unlikely to just be coincidence…I know you were unimpressed by what Metaxes had to say about water…but, speaking as someone who only drinks it or swims and bathes in it, I would say there were comments about water that I have not given much thought about, frankly. Interesting.

Some sections of the book were less interesting to me, or at least spoke about issues that I am more familiar with and may have had some questions about.

The finetuning argument (see Dictionary of Christianity and Science) is not something I have a problem with. If you do nothing with your car, it does not “fine tune” itself up…you need to have it looked at by a qualified mechanic. No one thinks it is automatic. Not in your wildest dreams do you think that. Things that look “tuned” generally had someone doing the tuning…you don’t run a marathon successfully just by accident. A bridge that stands for decades is there because (originally at least) someone did the math (tuned it) correctly.

The late Fred Hoyle evidently had the same sort of lightbulb flash on in his head at some point because he at least left a quote (for another author to use) declaring that nothing challenged his (Hoyle’s) atheism so much as some detail in the development of the carbon atom.

Likely there was not just a statistical problem (how likely that the atom could make this thing happen on its own), but some evidence of …well…design? intentionality? fine-tuning? direction? purpose?

All for now/

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My point was that most Protestants in Nazi Germany supported Hitler and his anti-Semitism.

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At the very least I like the title and it’s a book I’d download if Musk ever gets that machine to work: Attacks on Christendom in a World Come of Age: Kierkegaard, Bonhoeffer, and the Question of “Religionless Christianity”

Your point?

It’s not an irrefutable argument, and neither is the argument from evil or suffering. My professor from college gained some importance for developing an argument for agnosticism based on the high probability for the conclusion of either argument.

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