Having grown up as a child of the sixties and seventies, I can confirm that is true. It is interesting how YEism has taken over as a default position for fundamentalist leaning churches, and how that is fairly recent phenomenon .
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Likewise as a child of the fifties and sixties who was raised on the Scofield Bible I never heard of the YEC position. I am going to have to put on my memory cap to see if I can figure out the first time I did hear about it.
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The link between Old Earth and evolution as an opposition to Genesis is as old as evolutionary theory itself. When I was at college in the 70s you didn’t mention either at the Christian Union meetings or admit to it being more than an academic study.
I will admit that the term YEC seems to be more recent, perhaps just as a label.
Richard
It seems to me that the demand that the scriptures be viewed as infallible and essentially written by God is actually a low view of scripture. It implies that the scriptures can be counted on to speak for themselves and that they need our doctrinal claims to support them.
I found this interesting, especially the section on Bart Ehrman.
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When my sister-in-law wanted to go see the full-size model of the ark in Tennessee, I was surprised to see dinosaurs in cages on the ark.
The PCA statement on creation is rather conspicuously a committee compromise between those who investigated the various possibilities and those who uncritically collected young earth arguments.
A truly high view of Scripture is to see it as authotitative and therefore to try to understand it on its own terms as best as we can, correcting our understanding as needed. Forcing a particular view on the text is having a high view of one’s own authority. Of course, dismissing Scripture is also a low view of it.
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I’m going to push back on this, Timothy, as you are making a significant claim and accusation. What kind of evidence do you have, and how widespread is the issue within the PCUSA?
The evidence that I have is largely either anecdotal from clergy in the PCUSA writing or speaking online about other clergy at general assembly or my hearing about general problems in the denomination (I would have to go searching for specific examples). It is not a rampant problem in the sense that a large proportion of individual pastors are openly heretical, but I get a strong impression from people affiliated or formerly affiliated with the PCUSA of widespread lack of enforcement of doctrinal standards, with a few of the most egregious instances being openly heretical pastors.
I assume that in all large churches, there are deviating minority views. The crucial point is how the church/majority react to these deviating opinions.
I do not know the situation in PCUSA but more generally, the declining membership numbers and the strong impact of the surrounding society on the large churches that want to represent a significant part of the population have affected the attitudes and reactions towards the deviating opinions.
The attitudes are more tolerant towards the views that align with the majority views in the surrounding society and there appears to be a stronger fear of divisions within the church if the church reacts strongly to an opinion that may become more popular. In liberal societies, that leads to being tolerant towards the liberal ideologies. In conservative societies, the opposite may happen.
It also matters whether the deviating (‘heretical’) view is about a central or less influential issues.
During the last decades here, there have been individual Lutheran pastors who have been telling that all people will be saved and even that there is no God(!). Those cases have been dealt with a friendly but firm pastoral discussion with the bishop. At the same time, those who have been baptized with the believer’s baptism have been kicked out from the Lutheran church. If an individual pastor doubts the existence of God or eternal punishment, that does not threaten the church but deviating opinions about the baptism hits the heart of the church and is an existential threat.
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That sounds rather similar to the issues that I have heard about in all 7 mainline denominations in the US. I know most about the PCUSA, as it’s the one most similar to the denomination to which I belong, but have heard about similar problems in the others.
I’ve felt What Holy is many times when holding the Holy Bible in my hands even before I opened it. This is the Highest Feeling I’ve ever have, Moses was told Take off Your Shoes, this is Holy Ground, this is the High View anyone can have.
Right, because R was describing the gap theory (popularized by Scofield in the early 20th century) that continuted to dominate the fundie circles post-WW2, not the modern YEC nonsense.
Reminds me of Elizabeth Barrett Brownings poem.
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I love that one! We were just referencing that recently in some conversations with friends and acquaintances. Thanks
Here are two specific cases:
John Shuck (2015): An Oregon-based PCUSA minister, John Shuck, gained national attention for his blog post titled “I’m a Presbyterian Minister Who Doesn’t Believe in God”. In his writings, he argued for a “belief-less Christianity” and rejected the divinity of Jesus, describing the concept of God as an “artifact”. Despite these public statements, Shuck remained an ordained minister in good standing within the PCUSA for years, with the denomination citing its historic stance on freedom of conscience.
Dirk Ficca (2000): While serving as an ordained PCUSA pastor and executive director of the Council for a Parliament of the World’s Religions, Dirk Ficca famously asked a peacemaking conference, “What’s the big deal about Jesus?”. He questioned whether Jesus was the sole instrument of salvation, sparking a denomination-wide debate. The PCUSA General Assembly ultimately responded by reaffirming that “Jesus Christ is the only Savior and Lord,” though Ficca remained in good standing following the incident.
Context on Denominational Oversight
Book of Confessions: The PCUSA requires ordained officers to be “guided by” rather than “obedient to” the confessions, a distinction that has historically allowed for broader theological diversity among clergy.
Surveys of Clergy: A 2011 “Presbyterian Panel” survey found that 45% of PCUSA pastors did not agree with the statement “only followers of Jesus Christ can be saved,” though the denomination clarifies this often reflects a belief in God’s sovereignty to save non-Christians rather than a formal rejection of Christ’s divinity.
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This seems to be the sticking point for Christianity as a whole. It is viewed as elitism or maybe Nepotism and a very human, even selfish notion.
It can also lead to a knee-jerk rejection for people who have no interest or belief in the afterlife.
As a life long Christian I have always found that I get the best reactions when my faith (and preaching) is seen as being relevant to this life rather than the next.
Richard
In my general experience around Evangelicalism “high view of scripture” is just another in-group code word used to assure peple they are in the right club, reject and ostracize people who disagree, and ignore or justify the obvious blind spots or hypocrisy of the in-group. Like “sanctity of life” or “biblical leadership” or “covenantal marriage.” In principle and on paper, having a high view of Scripture would be a dividing line between Christians who believe the Bible is inspired and true authoritative and has a prime role in guiding doctrine and ethics and those who think it’s more an inspirational text and Jesus was a good role model. But in practice “high view of scripture” has become just another red flag for me. Another way of saying a fellow Christian is going to figure out how to discount my faith, experience, wisdom, and good life because I disagree with them about some interpretive hill they think we should all die on.
As for this whole PCUSA/PCA discussion, you can find good pastors in any denomination, but it’s not lost on me that David Black (PCUSA) is out at Broadview all the time quoting Jesus’s words to ICE and praying for the kind of repentence, justice, and mercy that scripture speaks of, and a whole cohort of PCA and CREC pastors who I will not name because I don’t want them to get any more attention are out on X all the time calling for repealing the 19th Amendment, defending the vilest forms of white supremacy, war crimes, and child abuse with their “high view of scripture.”
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IOW a high view means
“I have the correct or right view”
As such it is hard to dismount.
Richard
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Right. It often comes down to “My interpretation of Scripture is inflexible, but I need a way to pat myself on the back for it and pretend it’s righteousness.”
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Roger Olson has remarked the Chicago Statement on Biblical Inerrancy is another litmus test in that way, to divide the sheep from the goats from a certain perspective.
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