You seem to have a problem with keeping the conversation straight.
Yes, as I tell my wife, everything is my fault. lol. I see connections between facts and issues that need answering. I am not a linear thinker, which may be why I raise so many things.
Bill wrote*> I was reacting to this.*
Bill said: You made no mention of the water pouring into the basin.
Bill, I have pointed out that the basin was filling up in response to your posts. You clearly didn’t take the effort to read them. My responses below speak about the water pouring into the basin humidifying the air, and mentioned it several times, showing maps.
[quote=“gbob, post:8, topic:42578”]
It doesn’t take a genius to understand the adiabatic lapse rate, and the fact that the spray alone from these 200 mph streams of water would quickly humidify the air at the bottom of this desert
[/quote] post 8 replying to you Did Noah's Flood Kill All Humans except his family? - #8 by gbob
In the Is the Bible Inspired thread, I said this replying to you Clearly you didn’t take time to read what I said:
Estimates vary on the speed by which the Atlantic waters shot into the empty basin.
this guy says max was 40m/s. That is 89 mph
**This fellow says the Med went up a few meters per day. filling atthe rate of 90 sv. --that is 90 million cubic meters of water per second. the speed of the water depends on the size of the hole.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0031018215000735
I go into this because one could start the rain by the turbulence started at the Gibraltar strait and have it move eastward, to create the rain. A numerical simulaton of the influx, using a very small opening, which is not deep enough to bring in the ostracod mentioned by Hsu, has the water moving at 100 m/s
that is 200 mph, which would certainly stir up the atmosphere, causing turbulence, at the east, and once a convection cell started, it’s outwash would force further off areas to go down, and after that even further areas it would force air to rise quicker than the average. Is the Bible Inspired? - #60 by gbob
What part of ‘Atlantic waters shot into the empty basin’ did you not understand?
What part of 'filling at the rate of 90Sv–90 million cubic meters of water per second" did you not understand?
Frankly I think you were so dismissive of what I wrote that you didn’t even bother to understand what I was saying. You ignored what I clearly wrote. And then you say I can’t have a straight line conversation. lol
I spoke of waters moving upward in the basin. Where do waters lie when they are in the basin? At the bottom? Is that logical jump so difficult? I expect people to understand that when a thread is about the catastrophic Mediterranean flood that the water will not fill from the top down!
In fact we were talking about your “no rain” idea so that would be pre basin filling.
So you do understand that the basin is filling with water? How on earth could you have missed that? That is unbelievable to me.
> But let’s discuss this idea. Yes a water fall generates a spray of liquid water. What happens to the spray? Being heaver than air, most falls back into the water. Some with absorb heat (2264 kJ/kg required BTW) and turn to water vapor.
Yes, most falls quickly but you seem to be unaware of Stoke’s law, which governs particle size and terminal velocity. When the upward component of air currents is faster than terminal velocity of the tiny particle, it can be carried upward giving it enough time to absorb the heat and humidify the air.
> This heat will come from the surrounding air cooling it. You have noticed how cool it gets around a water fall and I was raised in a house cooled by evaporation. So now you have a source of cool moist air.
Not necessarily cool, it depends on the starting temperature of the air. and how much is evaporated. You seem to miss these little details. But once you grant me this, as the water continues to rise, the most air will get still cooler, and voila, at the dewpoint, the water condenses again and forms rain. So, yes, the logic of what you say above does get me excited, because it is precisely what will cause the rain. I am excited because you are on the verge of understanding the issue.
> But before you get too excited I will point out that Niagara Falls averages 35.4 inch/year of rain and yet the average for the US is 38 inch/year so it doesn’t seem to contribute to increased rainfall in the vicinity.
I didn’t say Niagara contributed to the rain in New York although it does in a tiny insignificant amount. I was trying to get you to understand that the water filling the Med, beneath the hot air would humidify that air rather quickly, and as it rose, it would condense again to form rain.
Niagara at most covers oh, say, 2 sq miles or so. The waters filling the Med were beneath nearly a million sq miles or 2.5 million square miles of hot dry air and within a short time the water would humidify the air. Now, the upward lift to the air provided by the upward filling water, would be sufficient to cause rain.
And your source of moisture has to travel almost 4,000 km to your Eden.
So? why would distance of travel make it harder for humidification to occur with each mile traveled? the rain won’t start until there is sufficient humidity, either blown in from the west in the form of clouds, or from humidification of the eastern area as the waters poured in. Noah wouldn’t have had to get in the ark until the waters were almost upon him. He could have lived happily for several months before the western mediterranean was filled up. the number on this already posted picture show the order of when things were filled. It took some months to fill the west before the east even began to fill. Notice the numbers 0 1 and 2 at the bottom of the eastern Med. The waters didn’t begin to rise until time 2-3 when the Sicily sill was finally topped. That means it spilled over it.
> Plus you have never proposed how this moisture, if it was to get there, is then lifted high enough to generate rain except to say it was caused by “turbulence”. Enough rain to last for 960 hours, because we know God does not lie.
Bill, You seem to have gone out of your way to avoid the fact that every post I have posted was about the catastrophic FLOODING of the Mediterranean. I have pointed out that the entire basin is filling with water and carrying the humid air upward. That was the very first thing you rejected because your son said that wasn’t possible. Your son is wrong. So you can’t say I haven’t offered an explanation other than turbulence. the turbulence could easily humidify enough air and cause enough turbulence around these 200 mpy waterfalls, to generate a self sustaining convection cell. Your complaint in this last part is nullified by the posts I have quoted at the start of this missive. You must be the only person on Biologos that has missed the entire point of this thread
I notice no mention of your plan and criteria for renaming all those rivers throughout geologic history.