Do psychiatrists believe demonic possession to be real?
I donât know any psychiatrists, but Iâm going to bet the answer is ânoâ for most of them, though there will always be exceptions. Is there a particular incident that brought this question to mind?
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Yeah i watched a video on YouTube the Biographic chanel that specifies on particular historical persons. He uploaded a video on Jose De Mariella ( i dont remember his exact name) but he was basically the chief Exorcist of the Vatican or something like that. Anyway in the end he raised the question if that is all real or is another term for a phychiatric condition . But he later show some bibliography of some physiciatric associations of different countries including the one of Britain in which it is stated that demonic possession is a real thing and it should not be treated like a joke.
Hmmmmm⌠Iâd be skeptical about that without seeing a verifiable source. However, I wouldnât be surprised if a psychiatric association wanted to clarify that demonic possession should not be treated like a joke for the sake of patients who may believe in it or believe that they are/were possessed.
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Bit ismt claiming that it does not exist comtradicts with the bible)?
Sure â I would bet most Christians accept the idea of demonic possession, though there are different interpretations about what that means. But I would not expect a psychiatric association to align their own organizational views with supernatural ones, Christian or otherwise.
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For me not believing in them does not contradict the Bible because I believe that they can no longer do it. When reading scripture I see these events shaping this subject. But I guess to explain one I have to cover another as well.
In the Torah I see that various spirits are sent by God to confuse individuals. The Bible even talks about them , the heavenly host , sitting around his throne discussing the various issues on earth.
Such as in 1 Kings 22:19-23 when the angels along with God decided to send a deceitful spirit to Ahab and mislead him. Same with the king who goes wild and eats grass.
But while all of this is going on we can see the trembles or something going bad. The serpent, presumably Satan, deceives Eve snd causes conflict. We see the princes ( angels) of israel and some others trying to mess up each otherâs plans and battling over it. But you donât really seem to read about a evil spirit on itâs free will taking control of a person. Instead you see them sent by God and his hosts or you see them trying to keep each other from aiding the us and you even see them, Satan, with the angels still marching with them going through the world checking. I believe they were created to help co rule just like we were with different focuses. But there is a problem arising, even the prophecies start to mention these issues.
Finally, when Jesus is born you hear that the king wants to destroy him after his conversation with the wise men. Gabriel warns them and protects them. They flee with the gifts just given them by the wise men. The king ends up killing many kids also fulfilling or tying into another prophecy. Jesus mentions that he saw Satan fall like lightening from heaven. He talks about how the devil knows his time is short. A eruption of possession takes place resulting in very powerful and violent men isolated cutting themselves and breaking chains, to kids unable to live their lives having seizures blamed on demons. These things start happening not previously mentioned.
Then you come to revelations and something is revealed about the war. The war was of the dragon convincing a handful to leave with him. The dragon tries to destroy the woman giving birth but loses and then a war starts.
A believe that Satan tried to lead the King to kill mary and Jesus. That was the final stick that broke the camels back. The angels warned mary and seems to have ministered to her while the rest went to war under the leadership of michael with Satan and those who followed him. They lost and Michael cast them out and they went into a rage mode , though restricted still it seems of power, and begin to cause issues and so before leaving Jesus have the apostles , and later Paul, a weapon against them that was found in the power of the Holy Spirit. The laying on of hands by the apostles. A gift that ended with them. As it was coming to a end we see other prophecies being fulfilled. The destruction of the temple. The coming of the kingdom of God. The apostles no longer able to lay their hands on others as that died and the gifts begin to cease with their death since no one else could pass them like they could ( acts 8 with what Simon the witch claimed).
So I donât believe the devil can any longer do that. I think the war we wrestle with bow since we have all scripture coming from God is to test all things and to deal with the flesh vs the spirit.
While I do believe that demonic possession is a real issue but I think we need to be wise in what is demonic and a mental disorder. Jesus within His cognitive environment dealt with may issues of âdemonsâ. Yes he casted out real demons, but at time He dealt with mental disorders which people at the time understood as devils and Jesus went along with them in the environment and casted it out, whether it was really a demon or not wasnât the issue, both issues are wicked and are oppressive and in a sense are from âthe evil oneâ and Jesus fulfilled His ministry in casting demons and sickness out of people. Jesus could have explained to the people that one certain person didnât have a demon in them but was mentally disturbed but that would have been hard to explain such science to 1st century peasants.
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Itâs true, ancient schizophrenics (and such) were presumed to be âpossessed by demonsâ or something, and this is an inaccurate way to describe the disorder.
BUT! I think there is something lost in the modern interpretation of schizophrenia. âPossessed by a demon,â is a personal tragedy. âAfflicted with x DSM disorderâ is tragic, yes. But the âpersonhoodâ of the afflicted is taken out of the equation with scalpel-like precision.
To see a schizophrenic as âpossessed by a demonâ is to see the person who, through no fault of their own (rather the fault of evil enacted upon them) has come to have a disorderly thought/behavior pattern. Conversely, when we see someone as "having this DSM disorder, we forget that the disorder that they are struggling with is more like demonic possession and less like a âclinical abnormality.â
They are real people who could have had different lives had they not been abused, neglected, or whatever triggered the psychotic break. People donât break with the psyche frivolously. They do it because they have to⌠or sometimes because they are forced to. The âdemonic possessionâ template (while factually inaccurate) explains these happenings more accurately in emotional terms.
-sorry for the necro-
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I believe that demonic possession was real. However, along with supernatural miracles like instant healings, speaking in tongues, and resurrection, I believe itâs ceased. The ending of the apostleship and the laying on of hands ended the ability to cast out demons and the end of possession. It was a horrifying event that resulted from the war Satan lost after trying to destroy Jesus through Herod. This weekend, I can post a bit why I believe that scripturally.
As in all phenomena we encounter, the natural explanation always works, supernatural ones leave no statistical trace; they explain nothing and make matters worse. As metaphor they can help, including when understood as such in the Bible. My psychologist almost certainly believes in demons, heâs a fundamentalist Christian church pastor. And a brilliant, highly qualified and experienced psychologist. Thatâs why I consult him. Even if I brought up the story of my thinking on the supernatural, which I have alluded to; he knows that I was a fundamentalist, he has never invoked the supernatural beyond resonating with faith expressions that I have used: faith is something he understands. I find his professionalism astounding.
Hi Everyone, this is my first post in here as I just joined today.
I want to propose an interpretation and possibly an explanation for your consideration and would really appreciate any thoughts you all might have.
I know that some Christians feel somewhat embattled by science and for that reason have a strong urge to resist any perceived intrusion by science into matters of faith, particular where the science might to be thought to give a sufficient account of phenomena such that continuing to hold on to a literal interpretation of certain parts of scripture presents a problem of having to decide which camp you want to be in.
The feeling I get from many of the above posts is that there are many who are wrestling with the task of finding some mid-point where demonic possession is (or was) a real thing, and may or may not have been a label that Jesus used, or that Psychiatrists use the term Demonic Possession merely to âhumorâ believers or perhaps secretly do believe in it but canât admit this for fear of what it might to do their careers. For those of you in this situation, I feel or you, and the difficulties you must be dealing with, trying to find a way to avoid having to take sides. I like the fact that you are sincerely and genuinely attempting to find, if not exactly a synergy, at least a workable idea of how all this can be reconciled.
The alternative to that synergy seems to me to be either outright denial of scripture or outright denial of science, and it seems to me that most people in here seek to avoid landing in one of these two camps.
So, I want to know if my interpretation of all this is accurate in the eyes of most of you at least. Do you see things this way on this topic and other topics where science and scripture tell a different story? Do you hope that some sort of synergy is found, otherwise you would end up having to take sides, and you donât want to be forced into taking sides? Do you feel that it is important to find ways to bring your faith and science together in mutual support or do you think it is better to defend your faith against the encroachments of science on matters like this topic? Where do you see yourself in this?
Any replies, much appreciated.
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If there is a midway though wouldnt there be cases? Wouldnt someone talk about it? Like if i was a doctor and a demoniac came to me and i couldnt treat him by no means with the practises of pshychiatry ,wouldnt i tell you or some friend the story? Wouldnt there be cases?
Hi Nicholaos, I apologize for my lack of clarity. I am not myself proposing that someone might be both demonically possessed and say Schizophrenic, or 50:50 or something like that. This is not what I meant by synergy.
I meant that people were perhaps leaning towards finding ways to explain or re-interpret the words of scripture in such a way as to not conflict with a scientific diagnosis (and explanation) of a mental disorder that does not include a supernatural component.
Yet another thing is that theres really no cases around the world of demonic possession that i known of. The only 2 stories which made headlines was that of emmily rose and that orthodox romanian nun.
Many years back, I heard a talk by a psychologist who did believe that demon possession existed and described an example. The case was somewhat similar to schizophrenia but had some weird atypical symptoms. Exorcism seemed to help. I believe that case was in Madagascar. But he did not attribute most mental illness to the demonic. He did note common spiritual factors relating to psychological problems.
The biblical examples do not have much detail, so itâs hard to assess precisely. Not everything is credited to the demonic, but specific examples are. And the terminology gives a lot of room for interpretation So itâs not a simplistic âthey attributed everything to demons back then but now we know better.â One possibility is that what we recognize as resembling symptoms of known psychological or physical conditions might be a side effect, rather than the primary result, of the possession. I would think that a person would be of most use to a demon if reasonably functional and able to influence others, not a raving lunatic. But demons seem unlikely to be either competent or caring enough to do a great job of handling people. âI was all set to get him into office, but he turned epileptic on me!â
Darn! I was hoping to learn a new word. But apparently physchology is just a typo.
The vast majority do not.
However there is one famous psychiatrist who stands out as either believing or coming rather close and I suspect that it may have something to do with his decrease in popularity.
I am talking about Scott Peck, and you might want to take a look at his book on this topic: Glimpses of the Devil: A Psychiatristâs Personal Accounts of Possession, Exorcism, and Redemption I havenât read it. I have read a previous book which I found extremely fascinating (if a bit chilling) called People of the Lie which details a rather interesting psychological perspective on evil â that is how evil gains a hold in people.
If hes testimony is true then that alone should be the first record of real possession by a doctor correct?
Hi David, I am very surprised to hear that a psychologist would make that claim. This can only be because of his prior religious convictions because there would be nothing in his scientific training that could lead him to reach that conclusion. This sounds to me like a gap argument. That being âI canât explain aspects of what I see here, so what I do not know and understand must be due to something supernaturalâ.
If the science of psychology had taken that approach from the start, we would not have a science of psychology at all and such a person would merely be a priest performance exorcisms. This is not psychology, and him being a psychologist gives no credence at all to his claims about demon possession. Rather, his claims about demonic possession discredit him as a psychologist.
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- Physchology : the study of how physicists perceive their role in society and relate to other scientists, especially from other fields.
If it isnât a word, apparently - according to some around here, it should be! 