I’ve always thought the Adam and Eve stories were great allegories for growing up. We start out innocent, and then we learn about good and evil. At that point, we can never go back to being children.
The flood narrative was clearly borrowed from other cultures. It is almost an exact copy of the flood story in the Enuma Elish. It even includes details like sending out a dove and a rainbow.
The moral of the story is pretty clear. God doesn’t like sinners, but will protect those who follow God.
I can understand your difficulty. I can remember when I realized that the physical reality you could see and touch indicated an ancient earth, and later a progressive evolution of the development of life.
If you are a believer, that leaves you with a couple of options: Assume the Bible is literal science and reject physical evidence and the physical appearance of things, with the then difficult question of what kind of God would place all this contradictory evidence in the universe, or accept that the literal historical way you had of reading those parts of the Bible is wrong, and you have to look at things in a new way in order to integrate both scripture and physical reality into a coherent belief system. The third option, and one that is put forth by some in the YEC camp, is that you have to reject the Bible altogether.
Oh come on Mike. Verse 5 says, “But they deliberately forget that long ago by God’s word the heavens came into being and the earth was formed out of water and by water.” If that’s not talking about creation then I don’t know what is.
But on the other hand, if he had said, “But they deliberately forget that long ago by God’s word Abraham and Sarah had a son although they were a hundred years old and ninety years old respectively” it would have had everything to do with Abraham himself.
In any case, even if we do concede that the link from 2 Peter 3:4-10 to creation is a tenuous one, at least it gives us something in terms of relating the Bible to the fact (and it is a fact, get over it) of deep geological time with its millions and billions of years. The only alternative is to believe that God created deceptive evidence on Earth for 4.5 billion years of detailed history that never happened, and in support of that, the Bible gives us nothing.
Obviously He didn’t maliciously, spitefully separate Himself from us, it is inescapable that He is relationally separate from nature as far as nature is concerned. Except in incarnation. And ‘by the Spirit’.
Can you elaborate on what you meant when you said “God was just a God of Israel back then?” I thought YHWH was for all people back then.
Also, why is the name Israel never spelled Yisrael? What do you think are the differences and similarities between Israel and Yisrael?
I understand the earth through evolution, and would this also contribute towards evolution’s understanding of Israel-Yisrael? Borders for what reasons? How does Borders speak evolution about periods of time? Because YHWH claim a place on earth, was that in YHWH mind billions years ago through thoughts?
But, remember when Israel was divided and lost the northern area? Was YHWH still God in the northern region after Rehoboam lost the ten northern tribes of Israel?
Rehoboam didn’t do anything but was punished because of his father, Solomon, yet Solomon wasn’t punished for what he did because of David. What exactly is that kind of passing down to a child that YHWH is talking about?
Was YHWH also evolution due to being actual time?
If you ask me, the days of creation are not real and nor are they periods.
What about covid-19? Doesn’t that depend on how old the earth is?
What would the 3rd Bt. say?
What is “the 3rd Bt.”?
Ah, so you’re not of the British aristocracy.
A post was split to a new topic: Genesis 1 as ANE royal chronicle
One problem: the phrase “heavens and Earth” are an ancient Hebrew way of saying “everything that exists”.
Ancient rabbis, back before Galileo ever set eyes on a lens, interpreted the first five and a half days as “divine days” since God was the only one there who could count time. They also concluded that those days were uncountably long beyond human imagining.
If simply thinking something could be a fable is the only criterion, then everything in the Bible could be considered allegorical. Is there anything in the Bible that you consider a legitimate historical account? If so, give me an example, and I’ll think it into an allegorical kid’s story for you using your own words: “The moral of the story is pretty clear. God doesn’t like sinners, but will protect those who follow God.”
I could probably do the same with any secular historical account that you believe is legit.
Is it possible that the event actually occurred and that the descendants of Noah kept relating the event down through the generations so that nearly every culture had their own version of an actual event?
You left out an option: Accept the Bible as true without having to reject one iota of physical evidence.
That is the option I have chosen.
I offer you another alternative: The evidence itself isn’t deceptive. You’ve just been deceived into believing that the evidence can only be interpreted according to one certain paradigm - and further deceived into thinking that your faith-based belief in this one particular interpretation constitutes a fact.
How does that differ from my second option? I see them as the same, accepting that my earlier understanding was wrong, accepting my failure to understand. Please tell me how that differs.
Slight problem with your reasoning. Scientific interpretation is not the same as Biblical interpretation. A few of the differences:
Scientific interpretation:
The last point is what really makes a difference in the two “interpretations.”
Biblical interpretation:
The paradigm that I believe evidence can only be interpreted according to is this:
13 Do not have two differing weights in your bag—one heavy, one light. 14 Do not have two differing measures in your house—one large, one small. 15 You must have accurate and honest weights and measures, so that you may live long in the land the Lord your God is giving you. 16 For the Lord your God detests anyone who does these things, anyone who deals dishonestly. — Deuteronomy 25:13-16
I’m sorry, but if you think that insisting on accurate and honest weights and measures is “being deceived,” then you must be using some strange new meaning of the words “being deceived” of which I was not previously aware.
“Let your conversation be always full of grace, seasoned with salt, so that you may know how to answer everyone.” -Colossians 4:6
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