You put your right foot in…
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As am I, and as I do. Although I do believe there is an objective answer to most questions (I.e. there is one objective answer to whether the world is flat or not), I think that there are some objective answers we will never have access to (I.e. are we alone in the universe?) and some questions that never had objective answers at all.
I think teleology as an approach is very Theistic as it requires an intelligence to provide or organise that purpose, but it also implies a control and manipulation that is uncomfortable to the free thinkers. Judaism would seem to embrace teleology with its view on how God controls all things, even those who do not believe in Him. So that foreign powers can be made to resist or even punish the Jews on behalf of God. But, this makes God manipulative and domineering, which is precisely what Jesus proved false in His submission to human cruelty, yet even that can be interpreted as God’s will
I guess free will is not very biblical and therefore can be considered a human desire or myth, unless you decide that Scripture’s stance is the human understanding rather than a revelation from God.
The Christian view of God contradicts much of the human created pantheons or concepts by having any concern for humanity at all, yet in the psalms that incredulity is actually voiced.
So here is where I leave orthodoxy and enrage some Christians as much as I enrage scientists. I allow my personal experience of God to override the letter or spirit of Scripture.
Richard
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I assume that the will of God and His purpose for our life operates at a rather general level. Living in a relationship with God, growing towards a (practical) life that reflects the good will of God towards the people and creation around us, and reaching the ‘goal’, the resurrection life in the presence of God.
Within this general purpose, there may be periods with specific tasks to do. It might be that God somehow reveals or lets us understand that He wants us to serve in some role, at a specific place. These tasks are temporary in the sense that they may change during the life - parts of our life, rather than the meaning of life.
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I think you are not distinguishing between the life of a believer and life in general. What you said is fine if you have aligned yourself with God, and chosen to accept His authority. I think the story is different up until that point, so in general terms life has as meaning as we make of it. There is nothing predestined nor underlying teleology.
God stands at the door and waits. Any predestined teleology would contradict that.
Richard
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When you read Ecclesiastes, read with the question in mind: What questions does the author actually seek to answer.
They are different from the questions that contemporary Westerners are asking, different from the questions that are assumed in this thread.
Think about the author’s valuing of or emphasis on action.
Think about the difference between the conclusions the author draws and the kind of conclusions we seek today. Do we need to adjust our expectations, perhaps?
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I believe that God has a good will towards all people, although He does not accept evil acts.
I also believe that we have (limited) free will and may choose against the will of God.
Taken together, these two beliefs lead to a belief that it is the will of God that people find a relationship with Him (through Christ) and peace with God. That will does not happen in the life of many people because of the (limited) free will we have.
This is such an interpretation of life and scriptures that can be criticized. Some denominations teach predestination but I do not support that interpretation. My interpretation is that God has predestined salvation through and in Christ - whoever turns to Jesus Christ and accepts him as their Lord can become part of the predestined salvation in Christ. As Jesus told, he is the gate and the road, whoever has gone through that gate and walks on the Jesus road will be saved.
As individuals, we may invent a personal meaning to our life. That personal meaning is not always meaningful, in the sense that our life could have a better meaning or goal.
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That is human justice not necessarily God’s view,
Grace and forgiveness has no limit. Furthermore, what humans consider evil (or not) does not/ cannot be truly compared to God.
It would seem that God is prepared to wait out even the most evil of doers. His patience is boundless as is His mercy.
But, again, your view has Scriptural backing
Richard
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I think religion has evolved as the answer to this perennial question. So -for some of us- the question might be why has the answer appeared in so many forms across cultures and what are the commonalities between the meaning their adherents value?
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My life means that I ain’t dead yet.
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I am not sure that there is a succinct answer.
Religion seems to concentrate on inner peace and happiness, linked to pleasing God.
There is, of course the negative No meaning at allt.
Then there is the personal goal of happiness that seems to be some combination of wealth, happiness, recognition/fame or power, that we never see to be able to fully achieve.
I guess there is an altruistic goal of world peace or some sort of unity for the good or benefit of humanity
The scientific view might be as simple as survival and procreation.
It would seem to be a philosophical question that does not need an answer for us to live and therefore is academic (In all senses of the word).
Richard
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I agree. I don’t really like the idea of God being a giant puppet master that decides all our life decisions, because that could then mean he is in control of our sin and (hopefully not) our decision to believe in Jesus or not, which then undermines the whole concept of free will differentiating us from God and that facing consequences of our sin because we decided to sin.
I’ve also had concerns brought up by some extreme Biblical literalists that said that Jesus only came to redeem the nation of Israel, and that everyone else that isn’t Jewish is doomed to go to hell. With my background in Evolutionary Creationism, I find this a bit contradictory, as I believe that God created the Universe with the hopes of having a relationship with all life and knowing that we will sin, but not with an original sin as posited in Genesis to explain why humanity faces death (as I believe that death is just a consequence of an entropic Universe rather than the consequences of anyone’s actions). Why would God create humans to have a relationship with them only to save a handful of them?
I’m familiar with the Final Commandment to make disciples of all nations but are there any other words directly attributed to Christ that shows that I, a non-Jew, will be saved by believing in Him?
God’s sovereignty over life and Creation has always been a weird question for me. On the one hand, if God has to intervene in everything, is he really a powerful God since he has to manually keep everything on track instead of creating everything to go the direction he wanted in the first place? (Or, as Professor Dave of YouTube painfully puts it, a constantly interrupting God is a “lame God”). But, if God isn’t present in our lives and having his hand in certain decisions, than what is the purpose of believing in a God if we can explain natural everyday occurrences just fine with natural explanation?