Pevaquark, I laughed when I read in that article âDear points out that seat belts might be considered carcinogenic.â They are. Makes me think of the society described I think in Hitchhikerâs guide, which solved car crashes by having a sharp metal knife coming out of the steering wheel pointed at the driverâs heart. Everyone drove very slowly.
My dau. In lawâs father almost died from a weird electrical problem in his heart. They put in a pace maker and I told him that all that did was ensure he too died of cancer. That is a carcinogenic pacemaker. lol
This is beautifully written! I am a Christian and I DO (bolded) believe God sent Jesus to Earth to be sacrificed on the cross to redeem us sinners of our sins. Iâve decided to walk in this faith even though iâm still scared sometimes. Iâve come to the conclusion that some things are just not meant for the human mind to know or fully understand. The Bible tells us to trust in Godâs word and not to rely on our own understanding. By the grace of God, I will see and know you in heaven sir.
Alewis, you are quite kind and I look forward to meeting you. The docs say I have only 6m plus or minus. The chemo is just barely working, and I am not going to let them torment me until the day I die. I am not so eager to live that I will ruin the time I have left. Donât get me wrong, I want to live, but I am going to go out of here consistent with my beliefs, that the soul is immaterial That isnât an easy read but my preacher actually understood it after two passes. I will give you my favorite quote from a physicist on this issue
Point is, this is the problem with consciousness in quantum. If my mind/consciousness/soul is subject to the laws of quantum, it creates a situation where reality (me seeing only one reality) is said to be false by the application of quantum rules. Again, I affirm that many physicists have discussed the role of consciousness in quantum and the belief that observers external to the physical world is NOT a looney bin idea, but a great problem in the logical structure of quantum. Again, (one of those quotes Pevaquark but a repeat, lol) "A careful analysis of the logical structure of quantum theory suggests that for quantum theory to make sense it has to posit the existence of observers who lie, at least in part, outside of the description provided by physics." Stephen M. Barr, Modern Physics and Ancient Faith, (Notre Dame: University of Notre Dame Press, 2003), p. 27-28
That means our souls exist! I figured this out the week I learned my cancer had gone to my bones. I learned of it in a science magazine I got that week and now figure it was a cheer up card for me. (no doubt someone will criticize this belief).
I know where I am going. After a 15 years of seriously doubting Christianity, I now have no doubts. They have been resolved. I can worship in church like I never have in my life. I have loads of opportunity to witness now, unlike during most of my lifetime. Just this morning I got to tell my new Tax accountant that I am content with what ever happens to me. She found out that I was sick because I made my son come with me because next year, when I am gone, he will own part of the business and will have to do the taxes. I wanted him to get an idea of what he must do.
I am an incredible statistical outlier. My cancer was spreading into my gut when it was discovered n 2003. It was highly malignant and the diagnosing doctor told me I would probably be dad by 2005. I looked up the stats and I had a 50% chance of making 2 years and 20% chance of making 5. Then in 2008, my doc told me I likely had 5 years. Then in 2016 she said I wouldnât make 3 years. Now she says 6 months. I think I will beat that; I donât know by how much.
I now have a new oncologist in the town where I live and she too said I have about 6 months but she had raised me with her colleagues because I am such a statistical outlier. She said she wouldnât bet against me beating that 6 months because she fears she would lose her money. lol
Life is good, our faith is real, it is historical, Christ actually rose from the dead, and our God, who is very powerful, had kept me alive against all the guesses of science. I have no reason to complain and look forward to the next world now (I never used to do thatâmy faith was not all that great or good most of my life). But if God keeps me around another year (which I hope he does, I am having a gas living this life), I will enjoy all the time I can and take the bad, the pain etc with as much grace as I can muster. Afterall, just think of the suffering Jesus put up with on that cross.
I just wish for one and all, even the accommodationalists I debate with, the joy of living this Christian life I now have, after a life time of struggling with the logic of my faith. I know this is real. I lift my emoji glass to you!
This reminds me of âLet Me Get Home Before Dark,â a poem written by the president of Columbia Bible College, who retired to take care of his wife with dementia. Good for you.
That is great news. I survived an easy bout with cancer a couple of years ago, but my experience was a vacation next to yours. And having learned a few decades ago that the most frequent mandate in the Bible is âDonât be afraidâ or one of its several variations â âBe anxious for nothingâ, âFret notââŚ, I have had reason to become practiced at it, but not like you!
Iâm glad you have your house in proper order. Gladder still that your belief in an everlasting life after death does not diminish your valuation of this life we have here now. As a non, it has sometimes seemed to me that too many Christians merely endured this life. Iâm glad youâre not one of those. As I told my mother who hated being the center of attention while on her deathbed, it is her time at bat but weâre all in our own on deck circle; weâre all in this together.
Thanks everyone, Dale, since I got this cancer, I have
1 had 5 patent applications (unfortunately deep sixed by Anadarko when my employer was bought out)
2 Lived in China a couple of years
3 learned Mandarin
4 co-invented several processes related to seismic dataâs relationship to the underlying rock material
5 started 4 businesses, one of which I still run; one of which was related to the above
6 Went to Antarctica, Tibet and worked a lot in Newfoundland
7 had an incredible number of opportunities to witness to my Lordâs love for us
8 figured out a superb argument that the soul is immaterial
9 and most importantly, irritated the accommodationalists. lol
I read something yesterday and it made me think of your post- As far as life on Earth is concerned âGodâs man, in the center of Godâs will is immortal until God is done with him.â
Iâve been reflecting on the different kinds of trials we each get and why, since I believe that they are designed for us individually. Iâm thinking that the crucible of yours is so that your gold will shine more brilliantly and that your Masterâs face will be reflected more clearly in it.
(Sometimes hardships are designed just to get our attention and to show us our dependence and neediness.)
Just noting how this goes against the standard wisdom we godless more often draw on when helping them through a tough time. Then we remind them that it isnât all about them. They havenât been singled out. They shouldnât take things personally. Here you are assuming the author of the cosmos has designs on them in particular, that it really is all about them. I donât think there is anything in my atheist lite experience which corresponds to the idea that everything happens for a reason and for my benefit. Do you find comfort in this? Is a fairly common Christian perspective I wonder? Are there any circumstances where you think it doesnât apply or would not be a good idea to give as advice or for comfort? Just curious.
Do you have any choice except to infer ultimate meaninglessness? Christians, on the other hand, should infer that everything has meaning, not that we will be able to discover or correctly deduce what it is every time. God is too big not to be involved in the minutest detail, including mutations in DNA â recall my nephrectomy account. âLuckâ should not be in a Christianâs active vocabulary.
I probably shouldnât be trying to answer mail today, As expected, chemo has knocked me for a loop, but here goes.
I think my Turkishtranslator experience was designed for me, to maintain the thinnest thread of faith during my years of doubt. I simply couldnât help but believe it was an act of Godâsuch an outlier of the same probability of the powerball selling only one ticket, and that ticket won. Everyone would rightly say the game was rigged. Strangely some try to say it wasnât rigged with the translator but would be for the Powerball.
I suspect it was given to me because God knew I would need it years later. If that is so, then he made me to go through those years of doubt.
I am not so sanguine about gold ahead (or whatever replaces it). I donât feel like I have been a very devout Christian,and certainly those who suffer for their faith in places like China, Cuba or other places of persecution, are far and away to be honored by us more than any of us.
Amen. I donât remember who said it, but it was something to the effect that the greatest Christian alive today was probably a woman with cancer dying alone in India. Iâm also reminded of âSarah Smithâ in C.S. Lewisâ The Great Divorce:
Since Dale has already answered, I will answered. When I was diagnosed in 2003 with my cancer, and the doctor, whose bedside manner was to yell at me that I was going to be his first patient to die since PSA came in and that it was going to be very quick, I went into the normal human depression at that information. I thought of all I had done as being useless, meaningless and it was all going to be tossed into the trash as soon as I was gone. I then thought of my older brother, who died of cancer when he was 29 leaving a wife and 2 tiny kids, and thought, âWhat do I have to gripe about, I saw my kids grow up?â Behind this thought was, the weak knowledge that I will see Gary again some day and he would think me a selfish wuse if I complained about what I had been given.
After that, I never went through any of the other stages of Katherine Kubler-Ross, other than acceptance. I never denied it, I was never angry, I never bargained with God. I asked for healing once, about 2009, but never againâGod knows my need and I donât believe in begging and repetition.
I do believe God has kept me alive far beyond the statistics for some purpose (yes, there is purpose in life and it is illustrated simplyâwhen you go to the grocery story, what is your purpose lol). If you get Gleason 8 prostate cancer and it is found spreading out of the prostate into other parts of your gut, the odds of you living long is not very good. I have out lived 3 prognostications of my death and am working on the fourth (July 8th this year). They say I have 6 months, as I have noted.
If anything, my cancer and impending death has made me realize how true Christianity is. There is even scientific evidence that the soul does not arise from matter (Wignerâs friend thread) and Mitchâs objections now can be viewed in light of his believe that there isnât really anything spiritual in this world because doing that would violate natural law. Spiritual stuff is in the next world as I see his views. I learned of that info on the soulâs existence a couple of days after my oncologist at MD Anderson told me it had spread now to my bones. I was a bit bummed out, not badly but I viewed that info as a cheer up card from God. Why did I learn of it that week when I had been working on that issue off and on for 30 years, failing to find the one piece of data I needed. But I found it that week. It is curious to me.
Finally, I can worship in my Churchâs singing time in a way I have never ever worshipped before. Earlier in life, death was theoretical. Now it stalks me and is very real. Four ribs with tumors, one on the spine, spots in my lungs, a gaggle of cancer in the lymph nodes near my heart (see it is near and dear to me), a tumor on my illium and one near my adrenal gland. I am a walking cancer. But I have found, God is also stalking me, being near to me, and strengthening me. I havenât cried over this for years. God doesnât owe me anything, not a healing, not longer life, nor a lack of pain. What he gave me is his love, and I saw it in action with that cheer up card I got from God in July 2018. He didnât spare his son, Jesus, why should I demand otherwise for me? I think I would be a wuse if I did.
Since I nearly became an atheist, what I learned of atheism and agnosticism, Yall use half of the data, the materialist part, and ignore the other half of the data needed to understand this world, the spiritual part. Faith is a part of everyoneâs life, but the key is faith in the right thing.
I guess I must have a choice since I donât infer meaningless. I wasnât asking to disparage your beliefs. Really I just thought this was something pretty different and perhaps worth noting to think some more about it.
From the outside the relationship you describe with what you think of as God may seem especially meaningful to you but I wouldnât trade my relationship with what I think gives rise to God belief for what you have. But if it suits you, more power to you. To each his own, okay?
This seems a little like saying everything is the most important thing. But that doesnât jive with my experience. Some moments feel more significant or special and others less so. But all and all, I wouldnât have it any other way. Life is sublimely beautiful and precious and I wouldnât want it any other way. But that doesnât mean the fourth hour driving on I5 when my back starts cramping up is as satisfying or meaningful as watching a new flower starting to form on a plant I put in a few years ago. Some moments you just have to get through to get to other moments. But the overall stew of moments is well balanced and I have no complaints.
I donât have a lot of use for âluckâ either but overall I feel lucky and appreciative. Life as a human being whether cut short or elongated past your body and mindâs ability to function properly is very special even if finite.
You didnât disparage my religion and I wouldnât care if you did. I have heard disparagement by some really hard nose atheists so I donât have thin skin in that regard. Honest questions deserve honest answers. But I will always defend my views, and I think everyone should defend their views.
When I was doing a negotiations, one guy went to my boss to tell him that I was a real hard nose. lol (that boss was harder than I), My boss told him that he could assure him that the hard didnât stop with my nose! lol I always figured my job is to get the best deal for my bosses; it is the other guyâs job to get the best deal for his bosses. If each of us did our jobs, we tented to meet in the middle. If they didnât. I took what they would offer me, even if they complained about it. It wasnât my job to represent them; it was his job. Similarly for each of our world views. If you believe it; defend it with vigour.
I can appreciate that. I have a Borg division of siblings, in which I am Second of Seven. (Sorry if this Star Trek reference doesnât connect.) But growing up, Fifth of Seven was sort of my apprentice. When his bad knees and feet got him booted from the air force at 19 he came to live with me. One beautiful Sunday we spent driving up the coast in his Fiat Spider. We stopped for gas less than a mile from home and on the home stretch a drunk passed out at the wheel of his big american beater and ran into us head on. I who always wear a seat belt somehow did not this time. Fifth of Seven had his on. I was in and out of consciousness many times, Rodney went into a coma from which he never emerged and doctors told my best friend who pressed them that he was brain dead. He did everything one can hope to do as the driver in that situation but there was no way to escape the collision.
I must say I attach no meaning to the fact that I survived without a seatbelt in the catapult seat while he did not. To think otherwise Iâd have to believe there was meaning for him to have lost his life so young. There is no way his life was less important than mine or that he was less deserving than I. It wasnât about me and it wasnât about him nor do I think the drunk (who also survived) was given an important life lesson. â â â â happens. We all die. And yet life is very precious still and acquires the meaning we find and claim.
Very understandable and definitely a human experience which can add depth if you donât drown in it. Iâd say you seem to have kept your balance. When my brother died, I was recently separated from my first wife, after months of disability I quit my job with little thought of what I would do next and one night while returning from walking past the place where the accident had happened again I wasnât paying attention and my first dog got run over by someone speeding out of a barâs parking lot. Sheâd fallen behind to sniff something but when I heard the tires squeal I called her and she came immediately to her peril. Needless to say I have also experienced depression just this one time for about a year and a half but I didnât seek treatment. I just read and slept a lot. I became uncomfortable around people and felt Iâd become duller, less insightful. I remember reaching a point when I decided I would just let go of wishing I was what I had been and decided to just begin again and see what would happen. My life would not have been anywhere near as meaningful to me if this had not have happened. Except for losing Fifth of Seven, I have no regrets at all.
Probably for many purposes. I think the purpose of life is to serve that something more that sometimes gives you more perspective than you would have living entirely for your self chosen purposes. After the accident I lost insight into other people, myself or much of anything else. I think losing confidence in myself left me open to what I could discover by just waiting and holding a space for an answer rather than being quick to fill all the spaces in as I would have in the past. They say sometimes you have to lose yourself to find yourself but I think what I found was what gives rise to God belief. Which is good because I think I needed some help and before I got it I realized how much we all depend on what is really given as a gift but which we think of as our own doing. I still donât think God is a separate being, it is far subtler than that. But I know there is something more and as a result I am more now than I was when I thought I was clever.
True for you is what matters. Go with that.
Amen to that. We literally swim in gifts. Nothing more is required.
I readily admit to having faith but I refuse to think I need to read about what it is I have faith in from any experts or historical eye witnesses of miracles. If it works for you, great. The main thing is to foster that relationship. Youâve done that. Believe me when it comes time to cash in my chips I wonât feel cheated in any way. Iâm glad you feel the same way.
As I have rejected accommodationalism, I also canât agree with the above either. What is true matters. Truth for me doesnât matter. The truth, or falsity of what I believe will be determined in the after life. If it is Parsiism that is found to be true, then I have wasted my life. And if it is atheism/ materialism. I wonât have any regrets because regrets are thoughts. Personal annihilation leaves nothing to have thoughts in. lol Did you think you would sneak that presupposition past me?
I really do reject this common idea of âyour truthâ. The implicit presupposition, is that there is NO truth. Truth for me canât be 2+2 =347298 and for you 2+2=5 at the same time. Both are not true.
lol