What I claim to know as a Christian is not disanalogous to my claiming to know my biological father – I know my heavenly Father, too.
Christians also should recognize that God had a two creation model from the start. (That is something that YECs fail to grasp when they insist that this first creation was ‘perfect’ with no animal death before the fall.) This one was subjected to futility from the beginning. A comment that I have posted after news articles on climate change:
Thank you for the clarification and I’m glad we agree about the desirability of good planetary stewardship even if we’re both uncertain how that will turn out. Naturally I hope for an honest attempt at a timely resolution of our current climate difficulties. I don’t want to hand on a broken planet for future generations to struggle over when the one we found in our childhood still had so much vitality. Like you I do despair that the political will can be found for doing what is right instead of pointing fingers at the other side while ignoring the iceberg ahead. But I wonder if you could clarify what you meant by a “two creation model”?
Thank you all for your responses. Just want to make it clear that my problem is not the case of multiverse in general, but this interpretation as if you hold it , you end up thinking that everything you do has no impact on the overall reality and so your actions seem futile. I agree with many of you that it sounds counterintuitive and even ridiculous, but I have read that many scientists and philosophers find it as the simplest and so the most possible answer, in regard to the underlying mathematics.
Then the problem seems to be one of identity. In my thinking your choices ARE your identity – I even believe that your choices create your eternal spirit. In that case all these others who choose differently are not you. So the question remains, which of all these possibilities do you want to be?
I think it is primarily philosophers who are responsible for this along with other seemingly odd positions such as determinism and solipsism which are mostly considered but not subscribed to. (Though there are way too many crackpots on my side of the theistic divide who decry the possibility of free will, a position they presumably can’t help but take according to them.)
He did not intend this one to be permanent, eternal.* One place this is evident is in Matthew 25:34:
Another place is Revelation 13:8:
There also are a couple of references to God’s creation of “a new heaven and a new earth” in both the OT and the NT.
Additionally, it means that Jesus was not Plan B.
*(…hence the objections mid-last century when big bang cosmology became the dominant cosmological model with its theistic implications and earning its name as a pejorative from Hoyle.)
**(I think the beast is the god Commerce, but that is another conversation. 
)
“You have to believe in free will, you have no choice.” I.B. Singer 
It is actually not possible for me to lose it. I could no more be spiritually unborn again than I can become biologically unborn. ‘Deconversion’ is a misnomer – God does not unmake new creations.
True confession: I was only referring to the faith in free will we both share. What theistic beliefs you hold are your own business but we don’t overlap there … distant cousin. 
Yes, I understood from your profile that we were not spiritual brothers. I hope that can change. 
That might not be comfortable for you. I’m pretty settled in what I believe too.
I’m not – that would be gross understatement. I can never not be my Father’s child.
You’re certainly more confident than I am. When I say I’m settled in what I believe I just mean that it hasn’t been arrived at lightly or without a constant weighing of conscience. Doesn’t mean I won’t change my mind with good reason, but certainly no abstract metaphysical argument is going to move me.
More importantly I don’t for a minute think anyone else should set aside what they hold dear in order to embrace my own conclusions. I choose to live in a world of peers. I respect everyone’s right to make their own decisions. I’m happy to discuss and enjoy doing so, but I don’t want to bamboozle anyone. I do tend to lose respect for people who try to hard sell me because it shows that respect hasn’t been returned.
That is a profound sentence right there - at least to me. And one that enthusiastic Christians ought to reflect on.
To tug on the other end of that same rope for just a bit, though, when you say:
Very commendable; but do you also have a desire to help people be freed from “bamboozling” by others? Especially if it is opportunistic or victimizing? And wouldn’t such attempted rescuing imply that the rescuer must know something or have some handle on a truth that the other ostensibly then needs? I.e. I can appreciate, and even celebrate your desire to avoid arrogance, but it would seem that in any worthwhile social or communication endeavors there must be something of a truth involved. Delivered without arrogance - hopefully. But it is no good pretending that communications should never involve a provisional side and a needy side. When one always fancies themselves as a “supplier of truth” (and never needy) - that arrogance is easy to recognize after a bit. But that social (and almost certainly epistemic) failure on their part doesn’t make those two essential categories (provisional and needy) disappear.
I think I see what you’re saying here. There is definitely truth out there to be had from others, and I’ve found plenty hanging out here that I’ve had no trouble accepting. The difference is the gracious, respectful dialogue. When we offer the reasons for accepting it nakedly without coercion and leave it to the other to accept or reject by their own lights, it is both more pleasant and more productive.
The decision to treat others as peers was important for me. No matter what I think I know about what is going on with others, really, I have to admit I can’t be sure. And imposing my take on them never really felt right anyway. The decision to treat others as peers inclines one to employ empathy more often and withhold judgement. In my experience that leads to a better quality of life.
I do. When I think people are being too coercive I almost always say something to poke a hole in their presumed authority. But really I find the best way to get honest dealing is to lead with it yourself, plus you’ll feel better about yourself no matter how often it inclines others to do the same.
Know that for most of us, being coercive to any degree really does mean caring. We’re not always so observant, though. Just enthusiastic. 
Well if you’re an example of coercive caring I’d say it is a non-issue. But I take your point. Christians do want to share their good news and some are sincere in their concern regarding the perceived consequences. I recognize that many Christians feel charged with spreading the word and I try to be tolerant when it comes up. But I would push back -in a discussion like this- that we all need to adapt to living in a community of diverse values and beliefs, and really none of us should insist that everyone must reconcile with our own. No one wants to be on the receiving end of that . Mutual respect, seeing each other as peers each entitled to stand by their values, is fundamental. Perhaps that is me imposing my values on others?
Well when you’re infused with God what else can you do? Holding it with some humor and perspective like this certainly does help.
Absolutely.
Perhaps we all do this without even realizing it. I think that nearly all who share are concerned with the reality of consequences and do so altruistically. There are those who are merely trying to win arguments, but that comes off entirely differently and is probably never confused with sincere sharing.
It has been a common rallying cry in the circles I grew up in that those promoting “tolerance” stop being tolerant of those they deem not tolerant enough. 
“Let your conversation be always full of grace, seasoned with salt, so that you may know how to answer everyone.” -Colossians 4:6
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