MacDonald (as selected by Lewis)

(242) Shame

‘If any man sin, we have a comforter with the Father.’ We may trust God with our past as heartily as with our future. It will not hurt us so long as we do not try to hide things, so long as we are ready to bow our heads in hearty shame where it is fit we should be ashamed. For to be ashamed is a holy and blessed thing. Shame is a thing to shame only those who want to appear, not those who want to be. Shame is to shame those who want to pass their examination, not those who would get into the heart of things. In the name of God let us henceforth have nothing to be ashamed of, and be ready to meet any shame on its way to meet us. For to be humbly ashamed is to be plunged in the cleansing bath of the truth.

From MacDonald’s unspoken sermon “The Final Unmasking

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Thanks for this. It is really down to earth, isn’t it?

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Thanks, Merv. It points out to me that shame as admitting our failings humbly in repentance and moving forward in Christ is far different from the shame I am more likely to feel on my on which is born of pride and an embarrassment at being seen as weak or incompetent. I need more of the first and less of the latter.

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Hey, Kendel - I forget in what back-thread we had been kicking around ideas about what sorts of common influences might have been in the air for GM and SK - and I couldn’t find it just now, so I’ll just post this here.

Maybe you already found this and I just didn’t realize what a treasure trove it was, but a friend just shared this link with me: Influences on MacDonald — The Works of George MacDonald
which is part of the larger site: worksofmacdonald.com (a vast treasure trove in itself).

I’ve only just begun to wade through the specific link (influences above). Two that they list there are Wordsworth and Wesley. I may just have gained a newfound respect for historical Methodism (not that I had any reason to not respect them before, but …you know what I mean.)

-Merv

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Cool! Thanks! I hadn’t run across this.
Been trimming a few brief articles on a different topic this afternoon and evening.
Thanks for this, Merv!

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Perhaps a fresh new take on “woke” from a couple centuries ago?

(243) The Wakening

For to be humbly ashamed is to be plunged in the cleansing bath of the truth.

As to the revelation of the ways of God, I need not speak; he has been always, from the first, revealing them to his prophet, to his child, and will go on doing so for ever. But let me say a word about another kind of revelation–that of their own evil to the evil.

The only terrible, or at least the supremely terrible revelation is that of a man to himself. What a horror will it not be to a vile man–more than all to a man whose pleasure has been enhanced by the suffering of others–a man that knew himself such as men of ordinary morals would turn from with disgust, but who has hitherto had no insight into what he is–what a horror will it not be to him when his eyes are opened to see himself as the pure see him, as God sees him! Imagine such a man waking all at once, not only to see the eyes of the universe fixed upon him with loathing astonishment, but to see himself at the same moment as those eyes see him! What a waking!–into the full blaze of fact and consciousness, of truth and violation!

From MacDonald’s unspoken sermon “The Final Unmasking

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(244) The Wakening of the Rich

Or think what it must be for a man counting himself religious, orthodox, exemplary, to perceive suddenly that there was no religion in him, only love of self; no love of the right, only a great love of being in the right! What a discovery–that he was simply a hypocrite–one who loved to appear , and was not! The rich seem to be those among whom will occur hereafter the sharpest reverses, if I understand aright the parable of the rich man and Lazarus. Who has not known the insolence of their meanness toward the poor, all the time counting themselves of the very elect! What riches and fancied religion, with the self-sufficiency they generate between them, can make man or woman capable of, is appalling. Mammon, the most contemptible of deities, is the most worshipped, both outside and in the house of God: to many of the religious rich in that day, the great damning revelation will be their behaviour to the poor to whom they thought themselves very kind.

From MacDonald’s unspoken sermon “The Final Unmasking

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Super busy week. I’ll be catching up on this thread today (I hope).

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(245) Self Deception

…the great damning revelation will be their behaviour to the poor to whom they thought themselves very kind. ‘He flattereth himself in his own eyes until his iniquity is found to be hateful.’ A man may loathe a thing in the abstract for years, and find at last that all the time he has been, in his own person, guilty of it. To carry a thing under our cloak caressingly, hides from us its identity with something that stands before us on the public pillory. Many a man might read this and assent to it, who cages in his own bosom a carrion-bird that he never knows for what it is, because there are points of difference in its plumage from that of the bird he calls by an ugly name.

Of all who will one day stand in dismay and sickness of heart, with the consciousness that their very existence is a shame, those will fare the worst who have been consciously false to their fellows; who, pretending friendship, have used their neighbour to their own ends; and especially those who, pretending friendship, have divided friends. To such Dante has given the lowest hell. If there be one thing God hates, it must be treachery. Do not imagine Judas the only man of whom the Lord would say, ‘Better were it for that man if he had never been born!’ Did the Lord speak out of personal indignation, or did he utter a spiritual fact, a live principle? Did he speak in anger at the treachery of his apostle to himself, or in pity for the man that had better not have been born? Did the word spring from his knowledge of some fearful punishment awaiting Judas, or from his sense of the horror it was to be such a man?

From MacDonald’s unspoken sermon “The Final Unmasking

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(246) Warning

…the horror it was to be such a man? Beyond all things pitiful is it that a man should carry about with him the consciousness of being such a person–should know himself and not another that false one! ‘O God,’ we think, ‘how terrible if it were I!’ Just so terrible is it that it should be Judas! And have I not done things with the same germ in them, a germ which, brought to its evil perfection, would have shown itself the canker-worm, treachery? Except I love my neighbour as myself, I may one day betray him! Let us therefore be compassionate and humble, and hope for every man.

From MacDonald’s unspoken sermon “The Final Unmasking

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I’ve listened to the whole sermon, “The Final Unmasking,” a few times.
There’s lots here worth commenting on, including the Lewis Highlights. Another gem.
Time.
Time.
Time…

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(247) The Slow Descent

A man may sink by such slow degrees that, long after he is a devil, he may go on being a good churchman or a good dissenter, and thinking himself a good Christian. Continuously repeated sin against the poorest consciousness of evil must have a dread rousing. There are men who never wake to know how wicked they are, till, lo, the gaze of the multitude is upon them!–the multitude staring with self-righteous eyes, doing like things themselves, but not yet found out; sinning after another pattern, therefore the hardest judges, thinking by condemnation to escape judgment. But there is nothing covered that shall not be revealed. What if the only thing to wake the treacherous, money-loving thief, Judas, to a knowledge of himself, was to let the thing go on to the end, and his kiss betray the Master? Judas did not hate the Master when he kissed him, but not being a true man, his very love betrayed him.

The good man, conscious of his own evil, and desiring no refuge but the purifying light, will chiefly rejoice that the exposure of evil makes for the victory of the truth, the kingdom of God and his Christ. He sees in the unmasking of the hypocrite, in the unveiling of the covered, in the exposure of the hidden, God’s interference, for him and all the race, between them and the lie.

The only triumph the truth can ever have is its recognition by the heart of the liar. Its victory is in the man who, not content with saying, ‘I was blind and now I see,’ cries out, 'Lord God, just and true, let me perish, but endure thou! Let me live because thou livest, because thou savest me from the death in myself, the untruth I have nourished in me, and even called righteousness!

From MacDonald’s unspoken sermon “The Final Unmasking

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MacDonald’s “redemptive judgement” (my term) is fascinating in this sermon. He even finds hope for Judas, which should give hope to any of us. But he also points out in this section below, that self-righteousness doesn’t spare anyone from judgement, not even us, who by comparison feel we are better than Judas:

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That really caught my attention too.

The shrillness of my own condemning voice is often just me perhaps subconsciously condemning the same or even worse in myself.

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Hello, Ernest!

What makes you think this? I’m not disagreeing … it just catches me a bit by surprise is all. The 1800s may have been something of a golden age or pinnacle for Scientism - and if so, do you think that would have contributed toward a cultural dismissal (if not hostility toward) everything metaphor? Whatever the reason, you’re probably right that if wouldn’t have ended well for MacDonald to be that explicit with his metaphors. Lord knows he already faced enough oppostion from his very own congregations for his own perspectives.

It still seems to be the philosophical air we breath, though these days those cultural airs are being mixed with a whole lot of other stuff that’s not one whit better.

It’s been a few years since I’ve read “Surprised by Joy” - his book about his wife, Joy. So I don’t remember all the details, but my one impression of Lewis that lingers from all that is that the Joy he and his beloved both had in each other made it worth all the grief and suffering - for both of them - many times over. He was a man deeply in love and deeply acquianted with Love.

You can get MacDonald’s “Complete Works” on Kindle or electronically at a very reasonable price. If you prefer hard copies, the Michael Phillips editions of his stories have been rendered much more readable to an American English audience. But if you can pick up and understand all the Scottish brogue that was more MacDonald’s native dialect, you can find those books online virtually for free I think. But the Phillips editions are worth it just because of their understandability. It wasn’t until this last decade that I finally “discovered” MacDonald through people of this very forum, and I’ve been reading him ever since. His novels (second or third rate as they may be in literary quality according to Lewis) are nonetheless captivating to me (as they were to Lewis) on quite other grounds.

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(239) Free Will (starting at the very beginning of the next sermon)

For there is nothing covered, that shall not be revealed; and hid, that shall not be known.–MATTHEW x. 26; Luke xii. 2.

God is not a God that hides, but a God that reveals. His whole work in relation to the creatures he has made–and where else can lie his work?–is revelation–the giving them truth, the showing of himself to them, that they may know him, and come nearer and nearer to him, and so he have his children more and more of companions to him. That we are in the dark about anything is never because he hides it, but because we are not yet such that he is able to reveal that thing to us.

That God could not do the thing at once which he takes time to do, we may surely say without irreverence. His will cannot finally be thwarted; where it is thwarted for a time, the very thwarting subserves the working out of a higher part of his will. He gave man the power to thwart his will, that, by means of that same power, he might come at last to do his will in a higher kind and way than would otherwise have been possible to him. God sacrifices his will to man that man may become such as himself, and give all to the truth; he makes man able to do wrong, that he may choose and love righteousness.

From MacDonald’s unspoken sermon “The Final Unmasking” (239 - 249)[/quote]

I find it interesting to read MacDonald in the present day, knowing how George MacDonald faced criticism throughout his career and in the years since his passing. This is especially true because MacDonald’s theological views were considered unorthodox by some during his time and many hardliners probably have difficulties with him today. In particular, his universalist beliefs, which suggest that all people will eventually be reconciled with God, were seen as diverging from traditional Christian doctrines of eternal damnation.

At the same time, the lines that are quoted here stating what God can and can’t do has me asking what his motivation was. Obviously, he was taking the Bible literally, and laying out what he believed would be to the benefit of mankind, but he was writing at a time when there was little knowledge of other traditions, other than transmitted by Christian missionaries and often interpreted to carry biblical principles. For me this means that he was writing with a limited vision, unable to see left or right, and his writing style and use of imagery seems to be overly sentimental or verbose, with a heavy reliance on allegory and symbolism.

Despite my criticism, George MacDonald’s works continue to be appreciated by many readers and literary enthusiasts for their imaginative depth and spiritual insights, but I find that the momentum of his writing, the forcefulness with which he formulates, sometimes overbearing. I have found many statements that would serves well as quotes, but often the quote in context has that brunt to it. What appealed to me more than anything was his exploration of complex moral and spiritual themes like in his novel “Lilith,” although I have heard that some people missed the kind of straightforward moral guidance that they were hoping for.

For me the biblical narrative is a collection of narratives worked into a history for Israel, as well as an anthology of religious themes, all with profound messages, but which become contradictory when taken literally. I see also mythology, legend, and symbolism, which also need to be appreciated for what they are, extending into the NT. We also have to take into account that the expansion of Christianity from its Semitic origins to different cultural contexts has led to significant cultural shifts over time. It spread across various regions and encountered diverse cultures, it naturally underwent adaptations and transformations that were influenced by the cultural, philosophical, and linguistic contexts of those regions.

Therefore, the view of MacDonald is a valuable insight into the creative religious mind, but needs to be viewed critically with regard with what we have come to know since his death.

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Uh. Thank you for your nice reply :slight_smile: I think, In the 1800s it was much the same as now, just the other way around, perhaps a little better. I often think Proclus was the eclipse of civilization…anyway, the problem wasn’t atheists, its was other Christians. For myself, really I don’t mind what other people choose to believe as long as the soul is in the right place. I don’t even know why the afterlife matters so much to so many people, I mean they run around trumpeting John 3:16 when Jesus said it to pahrisee who visited him in private, at night, frightened he’d be found out. I understand das consolation, but then it turned into a donkey’s carrot,but so what, if you want to believe in it fine. If you don’t, fine, and everyone gets angry at me for saying that all the time…THEN what happens is, when people insist on that others believe EITHER in increasingly unlikely supernatural events OR that nothing else exists but boring atoms, that emotions get intensified on both sides, and people get increasingly defensive about whatever position they take on it.

So as the age of enlightenment progressed, theists got very defensive. Now we are suffering from a lack of morality, and atheists are very defensive. A minority from both sides get hostile, which makes matter worse, in a kind of systemic racism–some people use beliefs in very bad ways, so everyone with the belief is evil. We went to war with Hussein for no better reason than Bush Jr. called his father’s worst enemy satain incarnate, and the parades of the righteous right stormed in and killed 2 million children, according to UNICEF. by bombing dams and electricity supplies, resulting in no drinking water, then cholera, typhoid, and starvation. That’s holy war in the 21st century, And we haven’;t seen the end of it yet, because people still are doing this systemic racism against beliefs. On all sides. So IO think its getting worse. Macdonald didn’t really have it as bad as we do now, in my opinion. Not many see it as I do, but there are some.

Anyway, Lewis I agree took it very well, I did try reading surprised by joy, and I know he felt he grew from the experience, but it just seemed such an awful thing to happen to him, that’s all. Life is life. And that’s my three word profundity of the day lol. Good night, hope to see you again :slight_smile:

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I think this one is about his conversion. The joy is his unexpected joy in God. (It’s one of the few of Lewis’s books I’ve read.) I love the part about how he unexpectedly found himself believing God on his way from one place to another. I quoted it around here somewhere. ……

Ah, yes, here:

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Right, this was his autobiographical book. I remember being surprised by the British boarding school culture he described that he attended. Not part of the joy, by the way.

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Wow … So now I can’t remember what book it was that I did read about his relationship. And apparently I haven’t read the Surprised by Joy book at all then! Embarrassing!

Thanks for the corrections though.

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