Leading neuroscientist on free will

[MarkD (A Whateverist, not a Christian)]

@Terry_Sampson

I’m still as much a determinist as I was, but I agree with you: we humans tend “to actually think we are making decisions and we think we actually work with others toward decision regarding public policy and the law.”

Oops! I wasn’t clear you were taking that position too. Now I feel like a cad. I never want to railroad anyone into agreeing with me about anything let alone something as trivial as this and most especially not you. Please forgive this lapse. Really isn’t just pure, entirely free will or else mechanistic determinism in spades. An adequate account should include something of both.

I’m working hard toward a deadline again and am woefully out of practice. So my participation here recently has been pretty much for the sake of a whiff of normalcy. So i won’t be at my best for several days yet. Sorry that sloppiness spilled on you.

[ARus (Alexey)]

What famous neuroscientist is a religious person other than William Newsome? Why do you think many neuroscientists are atheists? Is Modern Neuroscience Really Contradicting Christianity? Thank you!

[T_aquaticus]

@ARus

And in that regard the criminal justice system makes no sense at all. In fact, some years ago I got the MacArthur Foundation to fund this whole network and the proposal I sent to them was entitled something like, “Why the criminal justice system should be abolished.” And I actually meant it. ”

If we have no free will as Sapolsky seems to indicate, then we have no choice but to punish people for what they do because that is how our brains work. Kind of a Catch 22.

[T_aquaticus]

@Terry_Sampson

And we have to accept the fact that whatever our views are about blame and reward and all that stuff now, somebody’s not that far in the future is going to be looking back at us and being appalled at the confidence with which we made decisions amid our ignorance.

There seems to be a massive contradiction in that transcript. If the people of the future were consistent they wouldn’t blame us for acting like we are because we lack the free will to act differently.

The next layer of the free will Inception cake is to ask how they are able to act and think differently in the future. Did they choose to? What would cause this change in thinking through time? Are they just as flawed as we are because they are acting without free will in a way that might be looked down on by their descendants?

[marta]

@Terry_Sampson

SAPOLSKY: we need to be thinking of a quarantine model

We already have that, it’s called ‘prison’. But then I suppose the woke crowd doesn’t like words like this.

And this coming from an opponent of criminal justice system sounds weird

@Terry_Sampson

Organisms can have their behavior pretty dramatically shaped by reward and punishment under certain circumstances. It’s a tool.

I still don’t know what’s he proposing. Sounds to me very much like the system already in place, only with a new name for it. But perhaps I’m missing something here.

[ARus (Alexey)]

thanks for the answer. in fact, many influential neuroscientists take the same position as Sapolsky. they claim that their position is supported by science

[Terry_Sampson ([UILA])]

For the record: I’m not an opponent of the criminal justice system either. I’m not a fan of the death penalty. And I do believe prisons have their faults, but–like you–I consider them to be a form of “quarantine”, and I believe quarantine is appropriate and necessary. I’ll keep looking around to see if he’s gone more into depth on the details of what he thinks is needed.

@marta

perhaps I’m missing something here.

Maybe, but I must be missing something too.