Joshua Harris and throwing out the Bible

Education Forum
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I wanted to ask you and @Christie: Who is the keeper of the Pentecostal revelations? Are they recorded or written? Where can I study them?
Best Wishes, Shawn

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I don’t think there are any Pentecostal revelations. It is a stream of Christianity that favors certain interpretations of the Bible and community practices, specifically about the gifts of the Spirit.

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I’m not sure what you mean by the questions. Pentecostal revelations are not “added on” to scripture in some universal sense (in the way Mormons or Mary Baker Eddy might claim).

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It is good to see this getting discussion both here and on other venues like Facebook and various blogs. After thinking it through more, I see how much damage was done, and appreciate Joshua Harris for his openness and humility in admitting and repenting his wrong. If only we ( and our leaders) all had that kind of attitude about the mistakes we have made.

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Unfortunately, I note Joshua Harris has deconstructed to the point where he stated on a tweet that he no longer feels he would be considered a Christian. That is a problem with deconstructing from a very polarized position. Some of the comments discussed how some are uncomfortable with a theology of uncertainty and ambiguity. I can certainly understand, as the world would be simpler in black and white.

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very well put. In addition, coming from a fundamentalist background, where the issue of belief and creed is so urgent, we have very little patience with ourselves and perhaps with others when we come to places of doubt. It makes me realize more and more how Austin Fisher said in his book Faith in the Shadows, that it’s not doubts that take us away from faith, but the sense of being forbidden to doubt. I hope that Joshua Harris remembers that God is patient.

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Hmmmm… I don’t see that he’s posted much on Twitter lately but maybe it’s a reply I can’t see without having an account. If true, that is very sad. Legalism is so toxic.

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Oh, now I see what you mean – Instagram. Yeah, that’s interesting. It still seems pretty vague at this point. I sincerely hope that he is receiving grace rather than condemnation from the Christians in his life.

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Yes, Instagram. I use neither and was just going from memory on what I linked from Facebook. I really need to get with the program.

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No problem – I don’t use either either. :smiley:

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What’s Facebook? :smile:

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My question would be, “no longer considered a Christian by whom?” Pulpit and Pen or their ilk? Welcome to the club then.

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Well I guess it counts if you are no longer personally identifying as a Christian, as it seems is the case. Joshua Harris on Instagram: "My heart is full of gratitude. I wish you could see all the messages people sent me after the announcement of my divorce. They are expressions of love though they are saddened or even strongly disapprove of the decision.⁣⁣ ⁣⁣ I am learning that no group has the market cornered on grace. This week I’ve received grace from Christians, atheists, evangelicals, exvangelicals, straight people, LGBTQ people, and everyone in-between. Of course there have also been strong words of rebuke from religious people. While not always pleasant, I know they are seeking to love me. (There have also been spiteful, hateful comments that angered and hurt me.)⁣⁣ ⁣⁣ The information that was left out of our announcement is that I have undergone a massive shift in regard to my faith in Jesus. The popular phrase for this is “deconstruction,” the biblical phrase is “falling away.” By all the measurements that I have for defining a Christian, I am not a Christian. Many people tell me that there is a different way to practice faith and I want to remain open to this, but I’m not there now.⁣⁣ ⁣⁣ Martin Luther said that the entire life of believers should be repentance. There’s beauty in that sentiment regardless of your view of God. I have lived in repentance for the past several years—repenting of my self-righteousness, my fear-based approach to life, the teaching of my books, my views of women in the church, and my approach to parenting to name a few. But I specifically want to add to this list now: to the LGBTQ+ community, I want to say that I am sorry for the views that I taught in my books and as a pastor regarding sexuality. I regret standing against marriage equality, for not affirming you and your place in the church, and for any ways that my writing and speaking contributed to a culture of exclusion and bigotry. I hope you can forgive me.⁣⁣ ⁣⁣ To my Christians friends, I am grateful for your prayers. Don’t take it personally if I don’t immediately return calls. I can’t join in your mourning. I don’t view this moment negatively. I feel very much alive, and awake, and surprisingly hopeful. I believe with my sister Julian that, “All shall be well, and all manner of thing shall be well.”"

The information that was left out of our announcement is that I have undergone a massive shift in regard to my faith in Jesus. The popular phrase for this is “deconstruction,” the biblical phrase is “falling away.” By all the measurements that I have for defining a Christian, I am not a Christian. Many people tell me that there is a different way to practice faith and I want to remain open to this, but I’m not there now.⁣⁣

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Thanks for finding this. It must be really hard to struggle through that–for him and his family. However, George Macdonald would say that only God knows the heart, and even praised atheists for making the change if, at the time, it was a result of their conscience. It does sound to me that he is recoiling from perceived wrong he has done, influenced by a creed that he found initially to be righteous. It’s sort of like Emeth in Lewis “The Last Battle”–he fought against Aslan and the Narnians because he thought he was doing the right thing. Wesley said he would rather be an atheist than believe evil of God.

If he is falling away, it’s for the best of perceived reasons. God knows what his heart is, and the turmoil and his family are feeling. I appreciate your note above that Biologos can be a gentle area for those dealing with doubht.

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I appreciated this blog post from a fellow second-generation homeschooler. She’s right that this is not an isolated thing in the homeschool world, but still hopeful.

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Oaxaca is a nice place to be born, it’s where I am right now. :slight_smile:

Questions aren’t what crumble the foundations. Wrong answers are what cause it all to come crashing down.

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This is a good Christianity Today “Quick to Listen,” interviewing Drew Dyck about how to respond in a Christlike manner to family, friends and pastors who leave the faith.

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I also thought that Katelyn Beaty had a good piece in RNS regarding this and the “sexual prosperity culture.” We’ve had many a conversation about all this in our house regarding this topic, and some of the “breaking down” of all this evangelical loop holes that folks were required to jump through to BE the right kind of Jesus follower.

Also, I think this is my first response, so if I didn’t get something right, forgive me.

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I saw that Katelyn Beaty article and then I saw about five other people reference her “sexual prosperity gospel” on their blogs too. She nailed it.

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Thanks for posting. Good to have you here! You posted that like an old pro ( actually better, as old pros are often pretty shaken with this internet stuff, speaking from experience)