No, the opposite of what God is would be something that cannot have existence.
That’s not the part it plays in the story: the chaos water is a foe to be defeated, the earth is a place God separates from the waters, which are excluded both above and blow. Sure in the Genesis version that battle isn’t even a fight because YHWH-Elohim just dos with the waters as He pleases, but it’s still the imagery the story is meant to invoke.
Exactly, you got it! a nothing! the creation of the empty set/ non existence!. God created that which did not exist within himself! Creation ex nihilo. creation from nothing. The Circumpunct, the ancient icon of the singularity with a dot/ void in the center!
yes it hurts the brain… God who is all in all created a nothing in which to create the world! a negation within Himself.
totally agree with ANE trope.
but I am talking theoretical metaphysics presented… darkness = nothing, must come first then defeat that darkness by light. God can easily do it, death and resurrection. No problem for a God who can do all things!
John 10:17
For this reason the Father loves me, because I lay down my life that I may take it up again.
Is this how God creates the universe through the son?. Darkness is the laying down of life (empty set, juxtaposition, non existence of the Son)
Let there be light =resurrection !
that is what I am working thru
thanks
It has been that way for centuries, promoted by the Church. I can’t be remember who but it was a prominent ECF who said - we finally have the Word of God.
The reverse is also true, millions lost their faith because of “Evolution Theory” as no longer a theory but as true and in our modern world and are stamped into the minds of kids at school and meanwhile the Scriptures are called a myth.
But that does not include anything of Creation. Additionally, there is no indication in the text that God created “the empty set”; He created real things.
No – the only “negation” would be outside Himself.
There are no “theoretical metaphysics presented”, there is a theological discourse that sets off YHWH-Elohim as radically different from all the other elohim. The only “metaphysics” in the Creation account is that YHWH-Elohim is superior to all other gods because He made them to be His servants and tools.
More closely, it corresponds to the Incarnation.
They could only lose their faith due to ToE if they had been taught that the scriptures have to be scientifically accurate to be true. I never met a Christian who had any trouble with evolution except those given that false foundation, in fact most of them were awed at the elegance of evolution as a creative tool.
Rubbish. You can’t just make wild accusations without appropriate citations. Both Jeremiah and Ezekiel deny inherited sin,and Jesus claimed some people were / are righteous.
You are doing what you claim YECs do and universalising words aimed at a specific time and place.
Paul believed in Judaisic notions of slavery and no free will. I don’t.
So get off your high horse and either prove your accusations or shut up.
Richard
You called the idea of sin “ridiculous”, not “inherited sin”.
No, that’s your reading into the text
When a theme recurs through scripture, you can’t dismiss it as “aimed at a specific time and place”.
So you resort to calling Paul a false teacher again.
Your entire approach is to pick and choose what you like from the scriptures rather than learning from them. A great deal of it is done on the basis of projecting your subjective ideas into the text, e.g. your references to Paul. And it rests on your arrogant belief that you are superior to Paul and even to Jesus so you get to change what they wrote as you please.
Relying on the scriptures is not being on a “high horse”, it’s submitting to the Spirit. You repeatedly deny things taught throughout the scriptures and claim the authority to overrule things said only a few times. You deny that the scriptures are inspired despite that being their own teaching and that of the church in all times and places. So long as you continue in your arrogance I will not “shut up”, I will continue to rely on the scriptures, not on any personal re-interpretation of them.
I get that Troy, however, may i address a couple of misconceptions there?
see the following reference on this…
Please note that Jesus was not comparing the mustard seed to all other seeds in the world, but to seeds that a local, Palestinian farmer might have “sowed in his field,” i.e., a key qualifying phrase in verse 31. And it’s absolutely true that the black mustard seed (Brassica nigra = Sinapis nigra) was the smallest seed ever sown by a first-century farmer in that part of the world.
It’s also true, as many modern-day encyclopedias will tell you, that the black mustard seed in Israel will typically grow to heights of 3.7 meters, or 12 (twelve) feet—plenty large enough to hold a bird nest. Is the mustard seed, the smallest of seeds? - ChristianAnswers.Net
Luke 2:41,49
41Every year His parents went to Jerusalem for the Feast of the Passover. 42And when He was twelve years old, they went up according to the custom of the Feast…
“Why were you searching for me?” he asked. “Didn’t you know I had to be in my Father’s house?”
Finally, the disciples recorded Christs words in the Gospels. These are not metaphorical or allegorical writings, they are an historical record of Christs ministry to us…that is the entire purpose of the gospel. Of course the writing contains literary techniques that are metaphorical, but the historicity contained within those pages is not.
How do you explain the following:
The KJV bible, even though Textus receptus was copied by uneducated private individuals with no central body of control over hundreds of year outside of the influences of Jerusalem, is largely identical to the oldest known complete Critical text (Codex Sinaticus) discovered in Saint Catherines Monastry in 1844
The Dead Sea Scrolls discovered in 1946-56, are almost identical to both the Textus receptus and Critical text
The Kettef Hinnom - “Silver Scrolls” (dated to Solomons temple period 800-600 B.C and are the oldest text we have in existence) found in 1979, contain an identical version of the Benedictory Prayer (Numbers 622-27) that God spoke directly to Moses to teach to the Israelite Priests in the Sinai desert found in the other bible codexes ie Codex Sinaticus/Vaticanus/Vulgate and translations with no centralized professional control for copying ie Textus Receptus (from which the KJV was derived)
If what you say is correct about errors and misunderstanding original language, what about the fact that Christ quoted the text of Isaiah, which was already an ancient text in A.D 20’s? Isaiah made those prophecies concerning Christ 700 years earlier in a time where the language used wasn’t even the same (the Greeks and Romans had not yet conquered the region)
Im sorry but the claim of Chinese whispers and misunderstanding the original language…these claims do not pass the stink test. They are categorically wrong and the above evidences more than prove that idea is plain wrong.
Um, what? The TR was assembled by a scholar and was printed, not hand-copied.
Thanks for the questions Adam. First let me say I don’t have all the answers but I have moved from a position of fundamentalism to more balanced understanding about the bible. I am not a scientist nor do I really want to get into the nuances of scientific study and try and make the bible true based on rock layers and radiocarbon dating. It all feels similar to the dispensational mindset of finding the Antichrist in the european union and seeing the attack plans of the red army marching over the euphrates. Its overwhelming and endless debate. The jews of jesus day were also engaged in endless debate over indeterminable issues.
My main problem with YEC is that it claims their interpretation is infallible regarding the age of the earth and that all subsequent doctrines rely on that interpretation to be true. YEC becomes the foundation of christianity.
I would disagree with that hermeneutic approach. The entire bible is about Jesus Christ. He is the foundation and central truth claim. The truth is how the passage relates to Him.
You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; and it is they that bear witness about me
It is like a grain of mustard seed, which, when sown on the ground, is the smallest of all the seeds on earth
Jesus was 100% man 100% deity. Being ignorant of facts 1000 miles away proves His humanity and is not sinful. That is why we investigate things to learn new knowledge and discover more about God. God is always beyond our comprehension. We will learn new things about him for eternity and there will always be more to learn.
Matthew 24:36
“But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father.
this is another example.
Why can you say this here and not about Noah?
Our doctrinal convictions force us to interpret “whole world” differently in different circumstances. I am a calvinist and believe Jesus did not pay for the sins of the whole world. A universalist would disagree and say jesus did die for the whole worlds sins. we both use scripture to say the exact opposite.
A Catholic would say Baptism regenerates and real eucharistic presence. others have disagreed and paid with their lives.
Everyone is using the same text to justify their traditional view. Often times this becomes tribal and violence is perpetrated in the name of Christ.
Anyone who claims to be in the light but hates a brother or sister[b] is still in the darkness. 10 Anyone who loves their brother and sister[c] lives in the light, and there is nothing in them to make them stumble. 11 But anyone who hates a brother or sister is in the darkness and walks around in the darkness. They do not know where they are going, because the darkness has blinded them.
Christ teaching was mostly in parables… Matthew 13:34
Jesus spoke all these things to the crowd in parables; he did not say anything to them without using a parable
A literal interpretation would say, Jesus NEVER once spoke anything to the crowds except parables. But we find Jesus using other forms of communication with the crowds in other places, but we could say he mainly used parables.
I believe Jesus in his 100% humanity believed the flood account as written in the OT. And I believe he believed it to be most true in reference to himself. Just like he does with Jonah and the serpent on the pole. These OT stories are most true in christ.
said another way the stories are more true in Jesus than history.
The Bible is about Jesus 100% and sufficient in its revelation of Him.
Jesus is the foundation of history, history is not the foundation of Jesus.
But you are not. You have not quoted Scripture once here.
No I was referring to your views on it.
You don’t deny that you think sin is rampant throughout society anddmaking everyone broken?
Well, that is ridiculous and just untrue.
No more than He probably believed in a 7 day creation, a flat earth, a global flood, Adam as the father of all humanity, and so on.
Paul had his personal beliefs , like the rest of us, and they were based on his upbringing and what he had been taught. It makes no difference whether these beliefs are based on science or not. I do not have to believe the minutia of what he did or even taught. Paul was not God. he was human like the rest of us.
You do it as well, but justify it as being “science” or even “Local beliefs” . Well Paul’s view of Free will was a local belief of the day. It has no more validity than the 7 day creation.
If you think the world is “broken” you need to get out more. I guess, if you are only looking for brokeness that is all you will see. I know different, and no ancient theologian will tell me otherwise.
I have never said such a thing and I will thank you for not claiming such.
It has nothing to do with superiority. It has to do with personal beliefs. I am me, not Paul.
I worship God, not Paul. (And Paul said that was correct)
You are entitled to believe what you will. You are not entitled to condemn what I believe.
Richard
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