The only objective foundation for morality are good reasons (backed up by demonstrable evidence) why some things are good and other things are bad – and certainly not the arbitrary dictates of some supposed deity that some group of people believe in and speak for as little more than their own personal tool of rhetoric. I believe in God but not as a “because daddy says so” source of authoritarian morality.
God explains nothing. People like to use the word “God” in a bunch of rhetoric to make empty claims of explanation – but there is very little substance behind the words. In fact when you follow the logic and ask for details, the typical answer is an appeal to “mystery” which is inevitable when dealing with the whims of imaginary creatures. I believe in God but not as an explanation for anything.
There is nothing objective about meaning. This is entirely subjective. Science is objective observation, where what we want and believe doesn’t matter, but life requires subjective participation, where what we want and believe is central. I believe in God but not as means of pushing the meaning I find in life onto other people.
Few things are as subjective as fortune telling. I believe in God but not as a controller and author who transforms life into an already written story full of dead characters and authorial whims.
People find different things of value in the Bible. What I find of greatest significance is all the criticisms of religion. I believe in God but not as a self-absorbed glory seeking megalomaniac who needs people to tell him how great he is.
Amen to a gospel of salvation by the grace of God! But salvation by grace does not give assurance – quite the contrary, it requires faith. Those who talk of assurance have transformed salvation by grace into salvation by some formula of works – all in order to change religion into a tool of power they can use to dominate others. Yes I believe in the God of grace.
The resurrection of Jesus (physical only in the sense of bodily and not in the sense of natural or earthly) is certainly not well attested by historical evidence. This is another thing which requires faith. And it is important because life isn’t just about existence on the earth but an eternal relationship with an infinite being in which there is no end to what He has to give.
The main point here is that people differ greatly in the reasons they find for belief, so even if you don’t agree with the reasons of chadmangum and even if you do agree with the criticism of Dawkins (as I do) regarding the arguments for God addressed in his book, that doesn’t mean you will not find reasons of your own for belief as I have.
Here are a few things that have helped me with my faith which was really deconstructed. When I am doubting, which is often, I try to think about these things and not all the fancy philosophical arguments:
We are fearfully and wonderfully made. 40 Trillions cells, 100 Billion Neurons, 100 Trillion Brain connections, 60,000 miles of blood vessels. Hundreds of trillions of operations that form a baby at exactly the right split second and exact location using cheeseburgers and french fries as the raw materials. We could go on and on about the human body and mind but we are clearly designed by a creator…there can be no doubt about this.
Supernatural events occur all the time. For example, a friend of mine who is a Penn State graduate and environmental engineer was suddenly called into ministry in India in a supernatural way and he has told me about many supernatural healings he has witnessed in India…the blind are able to see and the deaf are able to hear. The supernatural things from the Holy Spirit he has told me about give me goosebumps but also help my faith. I think you can talk and talk about books and philosophy but witnessing the power God will override everything.
Of course there can be doubt about this. I not only doubt it – I disbelieve it completely. Design and life are diametrically opposed concepts. That which is designed is a machine. Only that which comes about through the self-organizing processes of choices, growth, and evolution is alive. Besides there is nothing particularly divine about intelligence or design. These are things which machines can to extremely well better than any human engineer. Looking for God in intelligent design is looking in the wrong place. The God of Christianity is a shepherd, teacher, and parent – a creator of living things, and not the great watchmaker of Deism. The latter not only turns us all into machines but reduces God to the ultimate machine Himself.
YES! They occur all the time right now in the present and not just in some mythical past which supposedly operated according to completely different rules. This is not because the laws of nature created by God are broken by Him in these events, but because the laws of nature are not causally closed. The supposition of Laplace’s Demon has been proven incorrect because of the new discoveries of quantum physics and chaotic dynamics. The laws of nature provide our physical substance and the structure in which our lives and free will can exist. But God created us for a relationship so naturally there is an open door for God to interact with His creation.
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Not can we find different reasons for belief than many of these old arguments, but we must be careful how some of the arguments used actually alter the very beliefs which they propose to establish.
Klax
(The only thing that matters is faith expressed in love.)
104
Sorry, missed this. An epistemology cannot possibly be changed without a crisis and I wouldn’t wish that upon you Dale.
Klax
(The only thing that matters is faith expressed in love.)
105
They didn’t happen then either. As you imply, the rules are the same.
The disagreement here with Klax is probably due to defining “miracles” and “supernatural events” differently. I don’t believe God breaks the laws of nature which He established Himself, but since the laws of nature are not causally closed, this doesn’t mean that God doesn’t have a hand in bringing about some events. That is what I am referring to when I agree with your claim of supernatural events happening all the time – events with a divine cause. As for Klax… he is so all over the place with pot-shots which he never explains, I am not even going to say anything about what he believes. I just remembered that he has previously objected to the way I define miracles.
Klax
(The only thing that matters is faith expressed in love.)
107
Miracles that don’t break the statistical surface are delusions, failure of epistemology at best.
Klax
(The only thing that matters is faith expressed in love.)
108
Which is why no rational person would engage in that false dichotomy seen by looking down the wrong end of the telescope.