Another word for hate is enemy of.
James 4:6 ““God opposes the proud but shows favor to the humble”
Esau was a prideful man, and didn’t even want or need his birthright.
Rather, Jacob, was weak and humble.
2 Cor 12:9 "And He said to me, “My grace is sufficient for you, for My strength is made perfect in weakness.” "
There is a reason God chose, Jacob, the little weak boy, David to defeat Goliath, Paul, a persecutor of Christians, Abraham, a man with a temper and bad speech ect. God’s glory is amplified when it is more obvious that a man could not do something. It can either be obvious that a man cannot do something due to an obvious flaw, or if man admits he is weak, and needs the strength of God. One is forced to humility, the other is recognizing humbly, that he was blessed to be able to do things through God only, but both are humbly, and God is exulted through that, and God loves them.
But Belshazzar, or Nebuchadnezzar Dan 4:36
“At the same time that my sanity was restored, my honor and splendor were returned to me for the glory of my kingdom. My advisers and nobles sought me out, and I was restored to my throne and became even greater than before. 37 Now I, Nebuchadnezzar, praise and exalt and glorify the King of heaven, because everything he does is right and all his ways are just. And those who walk in pride he is able to humble.”
Then the next Chapter 5, in Daniel, we see a prideful man, who was “hated” or in opposition to God.
There are many many many many more verses that speak of how much God loves us all that show that is true, and it was demonstrated when Jesus died for us. So when a few verses say, “God hated X”. I am more inclined to think that is an exaggerated claim. Like when the flood say everything on earth was wiped out, or god tells man to wipe out all, women and children. I think it is more likely that a dramatic, universal language is being used.
Rom 9:13
As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.
[TRANSLATION: God does loves everyone, but opposes the proud.]
Rom 9:14
What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.
[TRANSLATION: Who has the right to criticize God?]
Rom 9:15
For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
[TRANSLATION: He tells Moses that we cannot understand Him, nor be able to control Him, I AM, who I AM]
[quote=“gbrooks9, post:3, topic:38495”]
Rom 9:17
For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.
[TRANSLATION: God arranges that some people are doomed to show God’s power.]
This is kind of a rough one to explain. Like a child who is born in America with rich parents. It is more difficult for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than a rich man, to enter the kingdom of God. Not impossible, but difficult. God could have raised Pharaoh to be a great and influential man, and then use that influence to “shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth” However, the pride of Pharaoh got the best of him. Yet God was still able to “shew my power in thee”. He just went a different route. A prideful man opposes God, but it doesn’t mean God cannot handle the opposition, and still accomplish His will.
Prior to the plagues, would many think the Pharaoh was blessed by God, because he lived a good life? Would people think God cursed the slave, who lived a hard life? Who was able to know God more easily? Sometimes it is the lowly that can find God easier, are more blessed than those who live an easy life of luxury, who never see the need to thank or recognize God. It is almost a curse for them, who are made more difficult to know the goodness of God.
God will destroy those who are prideful. It is those who have luxurious lives who happen to have hardened hearts. A heart of God is soft, and heart of flesh is rock. One who has no seen or seeked God, who has received luxury and has not given thanks to God for that, and recognized Him as their source of blessing. They have never talked to God, they think of themselves as god, they will have a hardened heart. Again, the eye of a needle. Are the rich blessed, or cursed? All those who are humble, will receive mercy.
Rom 9:19
Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?
[TRANSLATION: Since no one resists God’s will, why does God blame us?] accurate translation.
I am not sure why you think it is logical to reply against God? There really doesn’t need any translation there. It says what it says. Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?
Rom 9:21
Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
[TRANSLATION A Potter makes what he needs with clay.] Accurate translation.
Who is to say what is pleasant and unpleasant? Would a toilet be happy sitting in a museum? Or is it happy doing what it was made to do? But if a toilet thought it was a vase made for the most delicate flowers, then of course it would be miserable and think the potter was unfair. Pride will lead to the vessels own destruction and unhappiness with what it is being used for. But humility and realizing that you are doing an outstanding job, and the household couldn’t operate as well as it did if you were doing your designed job will lead to joy.
But this isn’t a verse that is quoting God, and it say "God said “I show my wrath and make my power known, by making others suffer” This is a guy, who is saying “What if”.
Kind of like myself. I wonder things, I use my logic to attempt to explain God at times. Though ultimately, I trust God and know I will not always be able to understand Him.
But I have wondered at times if God didn’t possibly create soulless people to show His power. People that played a role in His narrative, and it seems they were punished, but not really, because they just ceased to exist, they never really suffered. Like a great actor, or robot. I don’t know if that is true, but I wonder that at times.
There are many things we can’t figure out, this is what Job is all about. His ways are higher than our, we can’t fully understand Him, BUT, we can trust Him.
Just like this thread The death of materialism - #3 by gbrooks9 .
I think it is fascinating and hilarious, and I see quantum physics as a modern day Job. How can something exist only when we observe it, how can something be motionless, and at motion at the same time? I see it as God kind of toying with us. “You think you can figure me out?, Check out this quantum stuff. Explain this”
I don’t think Romans 9 says that, or authoritatively declares that. Just because it is in the Bible, doesn’t mean it is declared or decreed by God. It is a godly man, inspired by God to write some great things about what God revealed to Him. But God didn’t reveal all to him, and some things, he is what-iffing. Even Paul doesn’t have all the answers. That is the purpose of that verse, Paul is saying, God is good, I can trust Him, maybe things work like X. Then Paul quotes verses that say similar things to support his guess. But then he ultimately ends with this in chapter 11 vs 33-36
"Oh, the depth of the riches of the wisdom and[i] knowledge of God!
How unsearchable his judgments,
and his paths beyond tracing out!
34
“Who has known the mind of the Lord?
Or who has been his counselor?”[j]
35
“Who has ever given to God,
that God should repay them?”[k]
36
For from him and through him and for him are all things.
To him be the glory forever! Amen."
So he says a bunch of what ifs, but then closes it all out by getting to the meat and potatoes.
MORAL OF THE STORY: For from Him and through Him and for Him, are all things. To Him be the glory forever! Amen.
You seem to be missing the forest for the trees.