Looking back over the thread for Lecture 4:
“Do we ever reach a point where that has concluded its “forward-pointing work?”
The temple completed it’s forward-pointing work when it was superseded by Jesus himself. The people of God were never left without something pointing forward to God’s Kingdom.
I suppose we must entertain the question whether “holy writ” does, in fact, point forward to God’s Kingdom. Assuming it does, we might need to consider how it does that; in what way it serves this purpose; what use we should make of it.
I hear part of the the counter: “You are forgetting the Holy Spirit! God gives us the Holy Spirit to guide us, to point to his Kingdom!” No, I am not forgetting. I am remembering, in addition to the proper understanding of and submission to the Holy Spirit, the misguided as well as evil claims ascribed to the Holy Spirit. Much of this is addressed in “holy writ,” which I find to function as an essential set of guardrails, guides. Without “holy writ” we can make up whatever we want. And people still do. I think we need those guardrails, even if people misuse or ignore them, as some did the temple.
One person’s “paper pope” is another’s window to revelation – the best we’ve got for now. I am unaware of the Holy Spirit broadly providing the level of detail about God and the Christ, or the Holy Spirit himself. Until some new pointer is provided that supersedes “holy writ” we will need to continue to use it.
Those who choose to prostitute themselves for the sake of power (some of whom are American Evangelicals) are not using “holy writ” as a paper pope. They are misusing it and twisting it. They are also participants in the very cultural layers that form them (as we all are). All the more reason to continually point to “holy writ” as guardrails and a guide to forming our thinking, committing ourselves to keep trying, looking for errors in our own thinking.
This is an overly-broad brush. Speaking myself as one of those American Evangelicals. I’m crushed by what is so widely accepted in “my tribe.” But “widely accepted” is not the same as consensus or homogeneity.
There’s plenty to be horrified at. But of the American Evangelicals I’ve shared the pew with my entire life, few fit the stereotype your comments reflect.
Additionally, I bristle at “brand loyalty” and the specific way it targets other “brands” of Christianity. Any of us may prefer our own tradition and for good reasons. Fine. But understand that there is always valid criticism available against what each of us prefers.
Me, too, @Andy7 . All the time. As the Church, and over perhaps most of her lifetime, we fail to make use of our greatest opportunity to share the gospel – by following the specific commands of Jesus. Actually, Wright will address your concerns in some of his upcoming lectures. But not with easy answers.
Yep. I like the way you put this.
And so was Jesus, according to Wright:
“Jesus’ parables offer his own redefinition of Kingdom of God. Remarkably, they’re seldom seen this way. One gospel scholar has even suggested that Jesus offered no modification of what the kingdom meant in his world. That’s bizarre! In fact, the kingdom parables all start from a supposedly normal kingdom meaning and then explain that the kingdom is coming but in a different, subversive fashion. The hope of Israel is being fulfilled, but not the way people thought it would be.” (39:14)
“The messianic theme in all the Gospels reaches its height in Jesus’ crucifixion. All four Gospels, fully aware of the paradox, see the crucifixion as Jesus’ royal enthronement…This is how the Son of Man is humiliated in order then to be glorified…Jesus was not politicizing the kingdom; he was redefining power and politics themselves.” (40:03)
I think (what appears to be) the absence of the bottom-up kingdom that you and Wright mention is evidence of the disobedience and distractedness of the church (at least in the west) for a very, very long time.
Like you @Terry_Sampson I am still looking for those details!
PS:
Hey! you guys! I can’t add to this thread until someone else participates here. I can’t even make another post to remind the group that Friday starts the Lecture 5 discussion, or to post the next navigational table of contents. Without your participation, the thread will die in 7 days.