Debunking Conspiracies (CDC Version)

A true linguist!

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An honest question I have is that I’ve been constantly bombarded by Fox News watching friends about the remarkable hydroxychloroquine (HQC). I know that the WHO has four global megatrials underway, but I get at least one, sometimes more, from my friends, mostly in the form of a Fox News clip in favor of HQC

For example this was one of the popular ones that I was sent multiple times:

Before this clip, I saw that ScienceMag did a little blurb:
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/03/insane-many-scientists-lament-trump-s-embrace-risky-malaria-drugs-coronavirus

But all I get are insults in return. None-the-less, I wanted to see what others in the field thought of Stephen Smith’s blurb and found this blog post:

It seems to take a look at some of the problems of this particular drug, but there are anecdotes popping up everyday about its effectiveness (mostly on Fox News):

I try to explain how anecdotal evidence is not a reliable judge of medical efficacy but am happy that she is doing well now citing this CBN article which quotes someone saying

“I can honestly say essential oils saved my life,” she told CBN News.

Along with her quote there are a number of claims that are not evidence based and could be potentially dangerous as it gives the impression that some essential oil will take away your fever or cancer instead.

But nothing seems to persuade those and we even seem to have our president stepping in front of the microphone to block Dr. Fauci from speaking:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/04/06/coronavirus-fauci-trumpdrugs/

Any thoughts are welcome and it can greatly help my sanity while I’m surrounded still by people who pray a certain few words everyday and believe it keeps them and their household safe from COVID-19 while they still continue to meet people with lots of people. And then when I say anything I get branded a heretic for not believing God.

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Well, there is this study:

It is a small study, but casts doubt on the claims.

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I can’t review all that just now - but apparently there is a story about Trump owning stock in the company that produces HQC. I am not encouraged.

I think you misspelled T-R-U-M-P. :roll_eyes:

I shouldn’t snark, but it is so terribly frustrating seeing people so scared they are grasping at straws, and may even do themselves harm in a pointless effort.

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Possibly of interest:
https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2020/04/08/covid-19-antibody-update-for-april-8

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I saw this one from the same author a few days ago where he says:

it provides no evidence to show that the HCQ/AZ combination had any benefit at all

https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2020/04/06/hydroxychloroquine-update-for-april-6

None the less I am still bombarded by anecdotal clips and conspiracy theories.

The most recent one is the WHO vs. Trump.

The thing that gets me is I see this type of stuff all the time and tend to go crazy following some people that are in my social circles. so I guess an honest question is how do you cope whenever you see people you care about just speaking nonsense continually? It drives me crazy and I want to spend all of the time that it takes to demonstrate why they are wrong. Which often times requires many many hours. But that leads to some stress sometimes with my family because I basically suffer from this syndrome:

image

Except that it’s not someone random on the internet, but it is people that my family hangs out with, it’s their a piano teacher or the Christian leaders in my community.

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Yeah, I understand how frustrating that can be. I’m on a facebook break right now (thank goodness) but my husband (who has a much better grasp on the math of all this than I do) has been banging his head against the wall at some of the things posted or shared by fellow Christians, especially those in leadership positions. He’s written up a couple blog posts about the math, and just today emailed a local newspaper because they posted a graph that was wrong. But I think there are times when you just have to politely speak your piece and then unfollow and move on… but I’m not always great at telling when that is.

I think some people see using social media as just “shooting the breeze,” and chit-chatting about things like they would be if they were just in a small group, without really thinking about the magnitude of influence they have in what they share, and why the stakes are so much higher when 500 people are reading it than when you’re just mentioning something offhand to a group of friends. And then when you try to tell them they’re sharing false information, some people see it as a personal attack. So sometimes unfollowing is really all I can do, and hope that the others still following them don’t take them as a reliable source. But yeah… it’s a lot harder when it’s someone you’re close to, like family.

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The anecdotal reports are frustrating. I has responded to a couple of Facebook friends who posted, and they respond by saying something like " But they took it and felt better 2 hours later…" to which I replied that proved it was not the drugs then, as they had just barely been absorbed from the digestive tract, and had not had time to work in a meaningful way. It is sort of like fertilizing your tomato plant and claiming the tomato you picked two hours later was proof the fertilizer worked. But, probably I just alienated the friend and accomplished nothing.

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That could be. It could also be that after the initial sting of your “snub” has receded in his memory and he hears similar thoughts expressed over the next weeks and months from other people, he might begin to think, “maybe Phil was right”.

-speaking as someone who has been on all sides of such things.

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Yes. It’s the stress–I realize that it’s the stress that makes my friends believe conspiracies; and it’s stress that makes me more irritated than usual with them. It’s good to realize that.

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It gets even more frustrating. IF we do a good job of flattening the curve, then in hindsight much of our effort is going to look like an over-reaction. The deniers will be crowing “we were right!”.

We should help those we can help. Those beyond our help are going to have to figure this out the hard way. :frowning:

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The pointer I use to deal with 'conspiracy theories is to recall incidents regarding Jesus Christ as portrayed in the four Gospels. He was critised, maligned and even killed because peopel saw what they wanted to see, heard what they wanted to hear, believed what they wanted to belief. He could not sway people who would not be convinced of the truth of His actions, teachings and preaching. Everyone has a choice whether based on rationality or irrationality … and have to live with the consequences. Phillip

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A true pedant. …

The BBC is the best soft propaganda machine in the world. The Soviets raged at it for its ‘factist propaganda’, i.e. the truth. From Reader’s Digest 30 years ago: A US pilot was shot down over N. Vietnam and captured. His captors told him “We’ve taken Hue.”, he sneered until they said “It was on the BBC.”. One of the very best autobiographies I’ve ever read is by senior BBC correspondent John Simpson. His account of he and his team in Iran is peerless.

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Yeah … but it’s what we’ve got. Probably the worst propaganda ever … until you consider all the others. I think the best stance to take is to read and take in everything with a readily critical eye, knowing there is no such thing as “unvarnished” publication. But to think that all propaganda is equally so, or equally deceitful or malevolent is folly in the extreme.

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This would be like me being extra careful as I navigate a tricky and dangerous traffic situation, and then (if I’m not involved in an accident) declaring …“well I guess all my attention and care was wasted because look … I wasn’t in an accident!”

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All depends on perspective. The overall death rate is down in the USA, due to fewer accidents and such. So I guess you could say Covid-19 saves lives.

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It’s beginning to sound a lot like immunizations. “No one gets measles anymore, so my child obviously doesn’t need a vaccine for it.”

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Exactly my point. :frowning:

I found this article interesting, though a little condescending in that it relegates conspiracy believers to the “Crazy Uncle Joe” catagory it seems, when many are otherwise pretty normal. The three motivations listed seem pretty accurate, however.

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