Can you elaborate on Islam being a heresy of Christianity? That sounds interesting.
I suppose that if I’m going to claim that Islam’s theology is false, I ought to be able to prove it, eh?
- Before continuing to focus on theologies and “provably wrongs”, I’d like to make one thing clear, … or try to. I have a niece who’s married into a family, more or less, who are “diverse Muslims”: some of whom are more devout than others, and others who are as ambivalent about their faith-connection as humanly possible. So far, I’ve been able “to run the rapids” in interactions with them without getting killed or wanting harm to come to any of them. God willing, I hope to get out of this world without exchanging blows with or trying to convert any of them, and I have yet to meet any who want to convert me. On the other hand, I am fairly certain that it’ll be a cold day on the equator before I actively pursue an ecumenical, kum-by-yah relationship with a Muslim (or, for that matter, with any other adherent of an Abrahamic faith-community: e.g. Baha’i, Jews, a wide swath of self-proclaimed Christians, etc.) I’m picky about who I fellowship with in a religious setting, but that pick-ness does not prevent me from sitting down at the same table and breaking bread with a lot of people; notorious in-laws among my wife’s family excluded.
- As for theological differences between me and others, I believe that the world’s “a mine field.” Among the things that matter to me are the crucifixion, entombment, resurrection, and ascension of Jesus of Nazareth. I believe in a cosmos in which those events were, are, and always will be possible. And I reject, upfront and “rat quick” any claim otherwise. If those are “faith-issues”, then “Yes”, irreconcilable differences in those issues are "deal breakers. And Islam’s claim that the Qur’an is perfect and disputes any of those claims is, IMO, false and contrary to what I stake my belief on. Is it conceivable that the Qur’an AND the canonical Bible are both true? In a cosmos that does not make sense, I suppose so. But I am convinced that the cosmos does make complete sense, and that there is no possible cosmos in which both the testimonies of the Qur’an and of the Bible are true.
- Is there a cosmos which makes sense, in which both testimonies are false? I am skeptical but I can’t “prove” that the Bible is fundamentally and completely false. On the other hand, I say again, I am committed to the belief that the cosmos makes sense, and I am confident that there are claims in the Bible which are possible in a cosmos that makes sense. And I am equally confident that the testimonies of the Qur’an and of the Bible cannot both be true.
- Bottom line: If both testimonies cannot be true, and there are claims in the Bible which are possible, I am forced to believe that the Qur’an is wrong and unreliable.
- That’s about as far as my horse will take me today.
No way, Christianity is the biggest heresy of Christianity.
Apostate imperial Christianity created the power vacuum in which Islam arose by mutual exhaustion in war with Sasanian Persia. Islam learned from that heretical Christianity.
It’s an EXTREME heresy of Christianity, with a unique theology and scriptures. Islam is one of the three Abrahamic faiths; they worship the God of Abraham. The Qur’an has garbled Christian Scripture with detectable influences from Gnosticism and Christian apocryphal writing, plus some unique teachings. It’s quite the tin of mixed nuts.
The Qur’an has many of the same characters as the Bible–Adam, Moses, Abraham, the prophets, etc. Muslims are more interested in Ishmael than Isaac, and believe that God ordered Abraham to sacrifice Ishmael. Their supreme prophet is, of course, Mohamed. The don’t see God as triune, so their Jesus is not regarded as divine. But he’s still regarded as one of the 5 most important prophets and the son of the virgin Mary. When Muslims mention Jesus in writing they also write (pbuh) after his name, which stands for “peace be unto him.” They don’t believe that Jesus was crucified because they think God would never allow a prophet to be treated like that.
At the end of the day, Islam is a different religion and I’m sticking with Christianity.
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You have some great questions. I grew up in a Muslim part of West Africa (though Christians outnumber Muslims in Sub Saharan Africa), and counted many Muslims in the area as friends. My parents were Christian missionaries. My dad said his favorite place to work was in the operating room, with a mix of Muslims and Christians.
This is a great website for browsing. Answering Islam, A Christian-Muslim Dialog and Apologetic (answering-islam.org), with a ton of good information
Phil Parshall has also written many books about the nature of Islam from a respectful point of view, though he is a Christian missionary.
The Cross and the Crescent: Understanding the Muslim Heart and Mind: Parshall, Phil: 9780830856305: Books - Amazon
I am happy to discuss my understandings of Islam. However, I am no expert. It’s even something to note that there are many different versions, and many Muslims don’t know their own faith (much as many Christians don’t know their own). very well. It just shows we’re all human.
Thanks.
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Thank you, Randy. One of the things I was beaten over the head with growing up in an evangelical household is the idea of hell as a place of eternal punishment God sends you to. All my life I believed that was the only valid interpretation (for some reason), and only recently have I realized that other interpretations can be equally, if not more plausible (I haven’t done that much research so far though). I know that muslims generally believe in the eternal punishment version of afterlife for non-believers, or at least it seems that way, so I wonder how Christians and Muslims can be so friendly often (as I see online and hear from acquiantances). I can see bow a buddhist might be very friendly and open with a Christian, as Buddhism doesn’t believe in punishment for people of different faiths. And sure, the Christian may subscribe to universalism or a similar idea, but afaik the muslim for sure believes the Christian is rightfully going to hell, so it just seems really weird to me. Can you shed some light on this?
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Although your question isn’t directed to me, nevertheless I’ll offer my own heretical opinion here, again, without intention or hope of “putting words in Randy’s mouth” or “stealing his fire”.
Muslim authorities generally classify Christians (and Jews and a varying list of others) as peoples of the book and as worshiping the right God even if they have a mistaken understanding. In their view as long as Christians and Jews live in a moral way, they will likely be in paradise. Hindus are a trickier case (and given Muslim/Hindu interaction in south Asia a pressing one) as are atheists. Indonesia, a predominantly Muslim country, classifies Hinduism as monotheistic and so they are considered an acceptable religion (along with Buddhism, Christianity [Catholic/Protestant], and Confucianism, search on Pancasila).
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And that’s why Muslims are permitted to marry Christians and Jews.
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Well, yes, but only men Muslims marrying female of the other type, right? It’s an interesting dynamic, and made likely to perpetuate Muslims in the children in a patriarchal society.
Interfaith marriage in Islam - Wikipedia
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Great questions. You know, though, that Jesus’ model was to love people who disagreed with Him–so we should be biblically better friends, not worse ones.
I’m sorry that your church had such a fearsome view of Muslims. It is really natural to do that, but really painful, too.
My uncle’s church, a devout Wesleyan one, sponsored Muslim immigrants a few years ago. Maybe we can do more of that.
While I don’t agree entirely with Carl Medearis in everything, I like his books “Muslims, Christians, and Jesus,” where he talks about how to talk with and enjoy Muslims as friends.
Muslims, Christians, and Jesus: Gaining Understanding and Building Relationships: Medearis, Carl: 9780764205675: AmazonSmile: Books
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I believe so. But Muslims are not permitted to marry pagans or non-believers.
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But there are lots of Hindu gods.
Yes but Hinduism is extremely diverse and some Hindus say that the gods are all aspects of the Ultimate. This is probably sufficient for the Indonesian authorities (note the Hindus make up at least 4 million of Indonesia’s citizens mostly concentrated in the island of Java so banning it could be bloody).
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That makes sense.Thanks. In discussing faith with Hindu coworkers of mine, they often referred to God as a singular, and I remember in Mere Christianity, by CS Lewis, he mentioned that the aspect of Hinduism which refers to God as the abstract from which all manifestations flow, was somewhat attractive to him too. I don’t know a lot about Hinduism though
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But not all of them
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You might find the SEP article on God and Other Ultimates of interest in particular the section on Brahman God and Other Ultimates (Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy)
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Fig leaves can be useful in society.
When I was in college I was courted by a refined Muslim man from Jordan, a graduate student in biology. Aish was dark and handsome, sort-spoken, and intelligent. We talked a lot, but that is all. The problem was that he was 30 years old and I was just about 20. That was too old for me! I’m afraid I hurt his feelings, and I’m sorry for that. Maybe in his culture such an age difference isn’t a big deal. I think part of the reason he liked me was that I dressed modestly and had a quiet voice. I do hope he met a nice woman eventually.
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