He does seem to make it easy! When he “speaks/writes” I feel the strength of his conviction… and even this ol’ Unitarian Universalist finds comfort in it… Isn’t That Odd!
Yes, and this is, perhaps, the most important factor in the success they have had during the past few decades. They believe that God created intelligent creatures so that he could communicate with them, and that it would be most strange if he arbitrarily stopped doing so some 2,000 years ago when ‘revelation’ ceased. As one example, they received ‘new revelation’ that dark skin did NOT preclude a male from admission to the priesthood of Melchizedek. Perhaps they will beat the Roman Catholic church to finding new revelation that women are also worthy of that honor.
My wife’s folks are practicing Mormons, and I admire the kind of lives their religion has encouraged them to lead. From what I have read about Joseph Smith’s philosophy, I personally find it most strange that a vibrant religion could be built upon such an incredible foundation. Fortunately, some of Smith’s followers set a more reasonable course. The present leader of our (currently) great country also has incredibly weak credentials for the job. Let’s pray that his associates can set our country’s leadership on a more reasonable course.
Al Leo
You guys sure do like your Mormon tangents, don’t you?
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I think their success is largely due to their missionary program; males are expected to devote 2 years of their lives to missionary work. Some females participate also. And the families of the mishes are expected to pay for it all!
And speaking of revelation, the Roman Catholic Church throughout history has come up with new “revelations” that their faithful are expected to believe. The Immaculate Conception (of Mary) is an example. Papal Infallibility is another.
Is this a problem?
I tried coming up with a “sin, cos, tan” joke, but I failed.
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Which just focuses on the problem: Who is “vetting” the new revelation? The Immaculate Conception poses no problem for me, for I do not believe any newly conceived life is burdened by Sin. Papal Infallibility is an anathema to anyone who respects human intelligence, as is the belief of Mary’s bodily Assumption into Heaven. Don’t be shocked. There are plenty of maverick Catholics like me–most of whom won’t admit to it publicly.
Did you understand what Christy meant by “Mormon tangents”? I did not get Jay Nelsestuen’s comment either. I can understand how Joseph Smith’s claim of magic “Peep Stones” and Golden Plates has opened Mormanism to ridicule, but I would hope that BioLogos contributors would not be so impolite as to take advantage of it.
Al Leo
Beaglelady and George seem predisposed to insert their fascination with Mormonism into many different threads.
Jay was making a trigonometry joke. Or failing to make one, actually. Based on my use of the word tangent.
Thanks for the prompt reply. I had not realized that Beaglelady was fascinated with Mormonism, and I guess both hers and my comments are tangential to this thread. I feel fortunate that in getting to know my wife’s Mormon relatives I can now put Mormonism into clearer perspective. Now I know that even a “queer duck” can start a worthwhile movement or even a religion. Of course Jesus was the true Founder of the Christian religion, but if Paul wasn’t called to promote it, we probably would not be Christians 2,000 yrs. later. And I think that if I had known Paul in real life, I would have considered him somewhat of a queer duck–a very persuasive queer duck.
Al Leo
If we could get the Mormons to endorse BioLogos … I think it would lead to some great things… maybe even a teen singing group … the tall dark male sings: “I’m a little bit Calvinistic…” and in reply the statuesque blonde sings back: “and I’m a little bit Pelagian!”
Record revenues would be directed straight into BioLogos coffers …
How many threads?
Three come to mind in my immediate memory.
I’m surprised the server didn’t crash.
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You are a kind and gentle man to try and make peace. But war is all around us.
you propose a political constituency to literal bible readers, which is a struggle to respect.
To me the Bible is God’s attempt to guide our ways, with history a side bar.
The old testament morality was done by Hebrews, with Father Abraham a wanderer. such that in many places the bible says to be kind to, do not molest aliens in your midst. As Abraham was a wanderer, and Jesus as a child was an illegal alien in Egypt. How can literal bible readers square that with the aclaim given Trumps anti immigrant policy?
Politically, Jesus was a tax paying communist, always looking out for the poor. Many famous stories are like Lazarus, where God condemns the idle rich. and the story about final judgement is how you treat people at the bottom of society, when you did it to the least of my brothers, you did it to me. seems like a proponent of welfare, raising the minimum wage . . .
I don’t understand how the biblically versed can not be “liberals”.
God, the inspiration of scripture is to drive your soul to compassion and forgiveness, with what you read in the bible of Ruth a foreigner, of all the Samaratins that Jesus cured. The biblically versed seem to vote without reference to the bible, But then want to challenge - astronomy (the earth spins around the sun), Geology ( the earth surface has changed and continues to change resulting in different types of rock - like sedimentary and igneous, different ages of mountains, and earthquakes) archeology ( evidence of humans at least 30,000 yrs ago, maybe 200,000, or more). Evolution is the soft parts of life changing, showing our connectedness to all life.
There are many inconsistencies in the bible about the FACTS, For example, Jesus’s lineage is traced to David through Joseph, who, we are told, was not the father of Jesus. You don’t have to go back and ask where did Cain’s wife come from if Adam was the first man. remember the Bible when you talk about aliens in the country, but don’t use it to date creation.
I want to cherish the Bible for the compassion and forgiveness that it calls us to, but if you insist that it is a document to be used to understand the sun and the moon, you belittle the Bible.
If you insist that the God of Adam cursing alll mankind forever is a true god, not just a story borrowed from neighbor pagans, you belittle the real God, whose mercy endures forever.
That is the problem with original sin, it comes from a God whose vengence endures forever, not the REAL God who is in the rest of the bible. You malign the Real God. Evolution is the sidebar.
We need to agree on what the Bible is, and what parts of it we take as messages from God, and what parts are anecdotes, fringe stories that have a point, but are like parables, some of the details are just there to carry the point, not factual.
It seems you are reaching out. i stumbled on Biologos where using only biology they are compelled by evolution and would still maintain biblical truths. Consider which truths are important truths from God
Jesus was a liberal? LOL. The only thing Jesus ever said about politics was that we should pay taxes. Everything else was in the context of the church, not the government.
Next you’re going to tell me he supported the killing of innocent children within their mother’s wombs.
Abortion is a banned topic. Just an FYI.
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Banned Topics? It never occurred to me that we had such a list.
Excellent! A nuanced and moderate use of a List of Banned Topics is a great way to avoid digressions form the “get go” !
I’ve never seen a written list, but it seems to be understood that topics that tend to incite emotions and controversy are largely avoided as evolution is enough to fill that void on the site.
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You stated it more clearly than I ever could.
Exactly right.