How can we explain the birth defect before the fall of adam

Sooo sorry guys i’ve been very busy and i didbt have time to read your replies… i see that nobody couldnt explain me … why God’s creation wasnt perfect since the beginning and why he allowed diseases and birth defect in children and animals

Hey Felizz,

The question you have regarding the idea that there’s death, disease, suffering etc. before the “fall of man”, is not an uncommon question… and which stems from a much deeper question as to why there’s death and suffering at all in the universe?

If you’re of the YEC variety you might say that Adam’s sin is the cause of all death, suffering a disease, in the earth and in the universe. This, to me, doesn’t really solve the question in a satisfactory manner. If this claim is true then we might have to ask: why did animals, plants, etc. become infected with death and disease based on the actions of one man? One might ask a big question as to why animals and plants suffer out of no fault of their own? I might argue what biblical passages are one using to saying that Death entered the world through Adam’s sin — I know about Romans 5:12, but the question remains… what scope of death are we talking about? Spiritual? Physical? Did the law of entropy come into affect at this point? Natural disasters such as tsunamis, volcanoes, earthquakes? The conversion of vegetarian tigers and lions to eating animals? We need to properly define our terms.

If you’re of the OEC or TE/EC variety you might say that death involved was merely the spiritual death of man (or some might say the spiritual AND physical death of man). In either case the question of sin and suffering in the world has long been debated, and today their are no easy answers…

The passage in Ecclesiastes says that God made everything BEAUTIFUL in his time… this does not mean perfect. And if it does mean perfect we still have to understand how the Bible defines “perfect”… do you mean perfect as in doesn’t have suffering? Immortal? In the same chapter of Ecclesiastes it’s main topic is the human condition: “A time to born and a time to die. A time to dance and a time to weep.” etc. etc. That section is one of the most oft-read and profound statements in the Bible… we can see that God makes everything beautiful, even in times of strife, in times of sadness, death, suffering etc… not that beauty is defined as the absence of sadness and suffering. But that beauty gains a much richer meaning BECAUSE of sadness and suffering.

It’s a really big topic, and it’s always an ongoing conversation; however I hope to have answered some of your questions.

-Tim

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Many opinions regarding suffering and disease seem to be based on an assumption that situation A existed before Adam sinned, and situation B existed after. It is clear from Genesis that Adam was placed in a unique setting - this means the setting was not typical of earth at whatever time people wish to imagine. In the setting of the Garden, and the state of Adam and Eve, there were no defects or diseases - this too is obvious. When Adam and Eve were taken out of the garden, they too were subject to suffering and disease. Just what does ANY scientific theory or speculation have to say on these matters - NONE!

It is an extreme view that proposes a conflict between science and faith in the context I have outlined. The Bible does not elaborate, nor display an ignorant race that has an unscientific outlook - people impose such nonsense on the Biblical accounts. If we have a “modern Christian” outlook to put forward, such vanity is easily dismissed by reading the account in the Gospel of John, regarding a man who was blind from birth (a genetic defect?!) and the disciples ask Jesus, if the blindness was due to the parent’s sin, or the blind man. Jesus said neither - what an answer! perhaps not scientific enough?

I think about that also but I also think about what can be done about birth defects now in 2015. Can research be done to understand and then to possibly eliminate them? Through scientific inquiry, experimentation and testing, we have made remarkable progress in both understanding the root cause of birth defects as well as eliminating them and treating there effect on peoples lives. What can we be doing now to eliminate birth defects?

ANSWER: We may not be able to eliminate birth defects, but we may soon be routinely repairing them at the genome level by means of CRISPR, an acronym for Clustered Regularly Interspaced Short Palindromic Repeats.

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CRISPR seems amazing. It is moving ahead in so many areas. Can’t wait to see this technology take off and have profound benefits to human life. I hope Collins at NIH is throwing boatloads of money at it but at the same time not stifling the research. Let it go where ever it goes and the results may astound everybody.

Part of the problem with understanding why bad things happen in nature is that the Church has often called them evil or natural evils. Theology insists God’s perfect creation was distorted so much that animal as even rocks are evil. But the Bible does not say those things.

Nothing on earth except humans (plus angels, demons) were provided the knowledge of good and evil, which is a quality God possesses. Knowledge provides a choice. Nature can produce horrors and suffering, but they are not evil as they do not have that kind of knowledge. Evil is based on our selfishness that disregards others.

Nature was around a very long time before Adam. The processes that God started before Adam continued to work the same after Adam sinned. That means that birth defects happen because the process that forms a fetus is not any more perfect then the process that form a rock. Sometimes things happen that disrupts the process. We do not know all the reasons. But it could have been a snake bite, a random mutation, or the lack of proper nutrition.

@GJDS

I have to challenge this view… with respect and a smile!

If DETERIORATION or AGING did not exist in Eden, then God would not have said this:

Gen 2:9
And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden. . .

Gen 3:22
And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

So, Adam was already aging/dying even in the confines of Eden.

How do we explain birth defects before the fall of Adam? Nature is imperfect. Nature is flawed. Nature has defects.

Only GOD is perfect.

Asking how there could be defects is like asking “Didn’t God create Adam as a God?” The answer is: No.

We need to put this kind of reasoning aside … it comes from a more romantic phase of the evolution of Christian theology …

George

You confuse the meaning of good and of perfect - you also misread what I said. The difference is between the garden of Eden which also contained the tree of life and that of the knowledge of good and evil. You are in error by adding notions of nature to the garden God created specifically for Adam an Eve.

And yet … you are unable to refute the fact that even Adam would have eventually died of old age if he had stayed in Eden but never ate of the Tree of Life.

George

What is there to refute? There are no facts that you seem to imagine - with the exception that Adam and Eve did eat of the fruit.

They ate the fruit of the Tree of Good and Evil.

God says they didn’t eat of the Tree of Life. And if they had … THEN and ONLY THEN … would they have been immortal.

George

And isn’t it interesting that the tree of life shows up again in Rev 22:2…

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Rev 22:2
In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the Tree of Life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded [the Tree’s] fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.

Rev 22:3
And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:

And the Curse is ended… NOT that the sons of Adam have been restored to original perfection.

George

Where does the text say that “the sons of Adam” had an “original perfection”?

It’s something Evangelicals think … so you should ask Evangelicals…

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