Yes, because his paycheck would end. Once again, for the fifth time, there is no comparison between biblical slavery and American chattel slavery.
And, once again, the only slavery where one could not run away would likely be people who were arrested and forced to work to pay off a debt, since running for them would be rebellion against the Israeli justice system (denying to pay his fines).
Yes, because Gentiles were more accustomed to paganism and other sins that could potentially distract Israel. However, once the Christ came, “there is neither Jew nor Greek”. I’m sure you’re aware of that passage.
What is wrong with paganism? Are you not for religious freedom? What sins are you referring to that could potentially distract Israel? The “sin” of not believing in what you believe?
Of course pagans deserve religious freedom, but not within ancient Mosaic Israel. People also didn’t have the freedom to do a lot of things in Israel. Israel wasn’t a lovely country meant for freedom riders to join with; it was a protected and holy (supposed to be holy) bloodline, meant for the Messiah to come through. Had Israel lived among pagans (distraction from God), idolatry (distraction from God) and evil (distraction and neglect from God and His Word), it would have caused Israel itself to become distracted, which would result in risking the Christ (the book of Judges covers a few of the times Israel has become distracted; not a good thing).
AKA, follow the rules and help establish the bloodline destined for Christ (the savior of mankind) to come through, or get out. Quite simple.
This is a Christian discussion forum focused on the intersection of faith and science. This thread has been, from the beginning, tangential to our mission, but it touches on biblical interpretation, so we let it stand.
Our main point of contention with atheism is the insistence of some prominent atheist voices that Christianity and science are irreconcilable. That’s it.
People who come to our discussion boards should be allowed to presume basic Christian areas of agreement like “God is good” and “the Bible is true” without being called to defend these presuppositions against the claims of those who do not share them.
If you want to argue theism vs. atheism, there are boards dedicated to that debate. This is not one of them, any more than it is dedicated to Democrat vs. Republican politics. Those kind of discussions don’t support our mission and don’t further the conversations we think are important. So tangents where people are asked to defend Christianity from claims like “the atonement is a sick and twisted doctrine” or “God is a moral monster” or “The Bible is a book of ancient fairy tales” just don’t belong here. Just a reminder.
This is the same experience the state of Israel is experiencing today. Israel is being torn apart by the internal strife caused by a majority people wanting Israel to a Jewish state where Judaism is the state sponsored religion. Very much like Islamic countries where Islam is the state religion. I am very much against this. I am glad I live in a country where each person can decide their own religion (or no religion) and the government is secular as in forbidden to favor any religion over any others. Mosaic Israel had no religious freedom and that is why it is considered a terrible example of what society should be like in the 21st century.
What paycheck? Slaves are not paid. You can’t make a false statement true by repeating it. Southern slaveholders found justification for slavery in the OT. The issue divided the Baptist church into North and South conventions.
How you can repeatedly make this claim or similar claims that slavery was ‘voluntary’ after admitting that war prisoners were also enslaved is beyond my understanding.
I completely agree. Like I said, it was a temporary Mosaic set up, the one and only purpose of Israel was to secure a holy bloodline for Christ to come through. It is not an ideal society, and I would be stoned 10x over if I lived near Israel. I’m a bit of a heretic, at least in Churchy Christian circles.
@david1 Here’s an #alternativefact for you, since you seem to like them so much: The Israelite slaves in Egypt had a wonderful time! The only time they were given beatings is when they were naughty, e.g. chasing cats. They had plenty to eat and meaningful work, constructing YUGE projects and working with gold! They made a lot of money, too! Things were great until Moses showed up. He got them to follow him out of Egypt but they began to go hungry. They remembered the haute cuisine they’d enjoyed in Egypt and even wanted to go back, but alas, it was too late. The End.
So you don’t think God’s relationship with the Jews endures? That they were mainly breeding stock?
But… that’s not historically, or biblically, true. There was no day of rest for slaves/servants, slaves building temple estates were given horrible, horrible conditions to live and work in, they couldn’t run away if abused, and there was no limit to the abuse Egyptian slaves could endure (Biblical slaves couldn’t be maimed).
I mean, if you want to make a point, at least try. Use history, use something at least comparable. Even if Egyptian slavery was all lovey dovey and comparable to Hebrew slavery, your usage of the Hebrew under Egyptian slavery is sad and uneducated. Anyone who reads the biblical account knows that the Pharaoh made conditions horrible for the Hebrew slaves, including murdering all Hebrew infants by throwing into the Nile. Where did Hebrews do that, again?
They wanted to go back because they were starving/dehydrated, exhausted and felt hopeless, a combination of emotions they didn’t feel, even in Egyptian slavery.
Those words never were typed, I never even indicated His relationship with them ceased. I said their purpose was to bring the Messiah into the world. Which is evidently true. By the way, God has a relationship with everyone, Jew and Gentile, its up to the individual to share affection back.
But it okay for you to make crap up. Like denying that the Hebrews practiced chattel slavery. I even checked with a scholar on this (Robert Cargill).
It was a lot more than that.
Chattel slavery was not practiced in the Bible, and you nor your scholar can prove that claim.
Two biblical facts: 1. Slaves could not be stolen. 2. Slaves could run away at any time, for any reason.
Sorry, but you’ll have to try harder to disprove my claims.
Prove it, please.
It looks to me like it is time to agree to disagree. The same contentions and objections are being repeated without any forward motion in the discussion. Last chance to add something substantive to this thread, because I am going to close it if it continues to be a “yes, it was” “no, it wasn’t” song that never ends.
Yes, things change, even from the OT to the NT. Examples include stoning adulterous women and taking multiple wives. As for slavery, it was wonderful slavery. In fact, it was just like going to Disney World.
“Let your conversation be always full of grace, seasoned with salt, so that you may know how to answer everyone.” -Colossians 4:6
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